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Re: Interesting Frankie Quote
Posted By: CocopjojoDate: 6/14/11 11:35 a.m.

In Response To: Re: Interesting Frankie Quote (Narcogen)


: To choose the video games as the authoritative form does not require
: selecting *gameplay* as the authoritative expression. The cutscenes of
: each game alone essentially comprise near-feature-length animated films,
: and that's in addition to all the corroboration that gameplay, perspective
: moments, and scripted sequences add to that when they aren't doing
: something that can't be assigned canon value because of gameplay
: requirements-- like invincible cinematic characters, for instance.

: For me it's an issue of primacy. Halo is a series of games on which some
: novels and other things are based-- some more loosely than others. As a
: series of games, they are exceptional, even if one of the reasons they are
: exceptional is how well they tell a story, something audiences expect more
: readily from other formats.

: As a collection of light novels, anime episodes, and comic books upon which
: some videogames might (or might not) be based, Halo is not particularly
: exceptional. To prefer them over the games would be like, if forced to
: choose between them, preferring the Ringworld games over the Ringworld
: novels-- which is something I would not do. The Ringworld novels are
: exceptional. The games are only of note because of their relationship to
: the novels.

: I realize who I am talking to here, and I'm really not trying to be rude--
: but for me, the creator of Halo is Bungie, just as the author of Ringworld
: is Larry Niven. So the primary works in the canon are the ones Bungie
: authored directly-- not ones they supervised, brainstormed, inspired,
: approved, edited, looked at, were aware of, supplied materials for or
: threw the Halo Bible over the wall at.

: In your example, a laser is a more accurate and complete method of measuring
: distance than the crude approximation of "eyeballing it", even
: for a practiced expert.

: I would not accept that a novel or a comic book is a more accurate, more
: complete, or in any other way "better" way of doing what Halo
: does-- which is telling a story that is in some measure interactive within
: an immersive fictional universe. In fact, I'd say that it gives little
: away to the other methods in terms of raw capability, and adds elements
: that are impossible in those other methods.

: I might very easily say it is because of those constraints. Just because an
: author can write whatever they want does not mean that they should. A
: real, living, breathing, working universe has real constraints on it just
: the way game developers have constraints on their time and resources.

: I might perhaps concede that game development is "more constrained"
: in one sense, but given the budgets available for making Halo games it is
: hard to swallow. I would wager that there are feature films made today for
: far less, with no interactivity.

: More realistic? I'm unsure how that even applies, except with the rather
: specific and limited situations like the friendly fire scenario you
: mentioned, and related invulnerable character issues. The necessity of not
: treating such incidents in a strictly realistic way is a gameplay-required
: concession-- just as player death and resurrection is, and I don't assign
: "canonical" value to those interactions, either. I can call the
: games the authority on Halo's world and story without putting into the
: story bible the idea that UNSC marines are highly tolerant of Spartan
: friendly fire, for instance, because this is clearly a gameplay-driven
: aspect.

: For me, playing the game is where Halo comes alive. It is a place I can visit
: any time I like. I may acknowledge that there are ideas or objects Halo
: might contain, but were never included because of the limitations you
: cite. However, it does not make the experience more enjoyable to read a
: novel where, free from those constraints, the author is then able to give
: those characters capabilities they cannot have in-game. This only raises
: unpleasant questions, draws undue attention to the design constraints of
: the game, creates further cognitive dissonance when feats that are
: impossible within the game-- even if merely because of the
: impracticability of depicting them within the game-- are given life with a
: few stray words in a novelization.

: I'm speaking generally, here, and not of specifics. This doesn't really apply
: to, say, the jetpack question, for instance.

: Honestly, within the ancillary material I've seen few things I can think of
: which could not have been included within the games, should the developers
: have so wished, and more inclusion of needless, pointless details and
: retcons designed to explain away previous conflicts in the games that only
: later end up being revised themselves. Those extra details are nice--
: except when the end up raising more questions than they answer, which is
: when they tend to draw too much attention to themselves.

I think you're still speaking much more broadly than I am. You mentioned not wanting to be rude because of who you're talking to, but don't worry about that at all. I'm not taking issue with you wanting to assert Bungie as the authority on Halo. I personally disagree with the idea (I accept Man-Kzin Wars as canon because Niven accepts them as canon), but I honestly don't think it's totally unreasonable for you to think that way. The particular instance I wanted to discuss was just where you said you accepted the fight between an Elite and a Spartan as more accurately portrayed in the games than in the novels.

You said above that feature films are made with less budget than the Halo games, but that's not the point - I could make a home video in my backyard that had me fighting a caterpillar and it would be more realistic than any video game today is able to be. I can roll a grenade along the ground, I can blind fire from any angle, if the enemy gets too close, I can grasp him, push him away, throw him on the ground - basically all the ways the fights are described in the novels. In the game, I can only do whatever features the game supports. Whether it's Halo or Call of Duty or even something like Fight Night, it will be a long time before the game allows me to truly do whatever I'd be able to do were it real.

So I wasn't talking about canon stuff, story stuff, exploration stuff or anything else like that. My original reply was simply regarding why you accept a fight between a Spartan and Elite as more realistic in a video game rather than in a novel.


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Replies:

IGN Halo Anniversary vid live nowGrimBrother One 6/7/11 7:25 p.m.
     Re: IGN Halo Anniversary vid live nowDani 6/7/11 7:29 p.m.
           Interesting Frankie QuoteGrimBrother One 6/7/11 7:37 p.m.
                 Re: Interesting Frankie Quotepete_the_duck 6/7/11 8:31 p.m.
                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteTDSpiral 6/7/11 8:37 p.m.
                             Re: Interesting Frankie Quotebluerunner 6/7/11 8:57 p.m.
                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteTDSpiral 6/8/11 12:07 a.m.
                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteArchilen 6/8/11 2:17 a.m.
                                               Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLurono 6/8/11 3:46 a.m.
                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteArchilen 6/8/11 4:00 a.m.
                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteBry 6/8/11 6:27 a.m.
                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLurono 6/9/11 3:06 a.m.
                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/8/11 6:30 a.m.
                                                           Suggestion?Leisandir 6/8/11 10:52 a.m.
                                                                 Agreed! *NM*Lurono 6/9/11 3:09 a.m.
                                                           This post perfectly sums up what's wrong.PsychoRaven 6/8/11 11:45 a.m.
                                                                 Damn it. This post was meant in reply to Narcogen.PsychoRaven 6/8/11 11:46 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Damn it. This post was meant in reply to NarcoArchilen 6/8/11 11:49 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Damn it. This post was meant in reply to NarcoPsychoRaven 6/8/11 11:52 a.m.
                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDHalo 6/8/11 2:17 p.m.
                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteArchilen 6/8/11 2:28 p.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDHalo 6/8/11 6:53 p.m.
                                                                             second'd *NM*Leisandir 6/8/11 7:20 p.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/9/11 1:08 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDHalo 6/9/11 7:55 a.m.
                                                                                         And to be honest...DHalo 6/9/11 8:17 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: And to be honest...Narcogen 6/10/11 4:12 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/10/11 4:08 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteGeneral Vagueness 6/9/11 5:53 p.m.
                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/9/11 1:04 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDHalo 6/9/11 8:45 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteArchilen 6/9/11 9:10 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDHalo 6/9/11 9:35 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/10/11 1:57 a.m.
                                                                                   Oh! I see what the problem is.Leisandir 6/9/11 10:01 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Oh! I see what the problem is.Narcogen 6/10/11 2:11 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: Oh! I see what the problem is.Leisandir 6/10/11 7:58 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/10/11 1:49 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/10/11 6:21 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteQuirel 6/10/11 9:27 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/10/11 10:22 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteQuirel 6/10/11 10:38 a.m.
                                                                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/10/11 10:47 a.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/13/11 1:39 a.m.
                                                                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCocopjojo 6/13/11 2:49 a.m.
                                                                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/13/11 5:24 a.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCocopjojo 6/13/11 7:41 p.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDEEP NNN 6/13/11 7:56 p.m.
                                                                                                                                         You're Doing It Wrong *NM*The Loot 6/13/11 10:03 p.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/14/11 2:01 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCocopjojo 6/14/11 3:26 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/14/11 4:29 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCocopjojo 6/14/11 11:35 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/15/11 3:03 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/13/11 1:36 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/13/11 1:32 a.m.
                                                                       You people are confusing me.Louis Wu 6/13/11 11:01 a.m.
                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.mnemesis 6/13/11 11:15 a.m.
                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.Vandle Valsher 6/13/11 11:17 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.Louis Wu 6/13/11 11:34 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.excowboy83 6/13/11 11:52 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.Vandle Valsher 6/13/11 12:24 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.Louis Wu 6/13/11 1:10 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: You people are confusing me.Vandle Valsher 6/13/11 1:35 p.m.
                                                                                                           Re: You people are confusing me.Louis Wu 6/13/11 2:47 p.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: You people are confusing me.Vandle Valsher 6/13/11 3:51 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/14/11 1:21 a.m.
                                                                                               Wat.Leisandir 6/13/11 1:39 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Wat.Bones153 6/13/11 2:28 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.Quirel 6/13/11 4:57 p.m.
                                                                             — INTERMISSION —kapowaz 6/13/11 11:28 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: — INTERMISSION —Louis Wu 6/13/11 11:38 a.m.
                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.Captain Spark 6/13/11 12:28 p.m.
                                                                             I am with you WuSl'askia 6/13/11 12:30 p.m.
                                                                                   Just thought I'd add...Sl'askia 6/13/11 12:37 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: I am with you WuDocument 6/13/11 12:47 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: I am with you WuSl'askia 6/13/11 1:00 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: I am with you Wubluerunner 6/13/11 1:08 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: I am with you WuSl'askia 6/13/11 1:21 p.m.
                                                                             I don't think I actually even interpreted...Leviathan 6/13/11 1:47 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: I don't think I actually even interpreted...BlueNinja 6/13/11 4:32 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: I don't think I actually even interpreted...Louis Wu 6/13/11 4:54 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: I don't think I actually even interpreted...BlueNinja 6/13/11 5:28 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: I don't think I actually even interpreted...Leviathan 6/13/11 5:50 p.m.
                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.uberfoop 6/13/11 4:03 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.Louis Wu 6/13/11 5:06 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.uberfoop 6/13/11 6:03 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/14/11 1:34 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/13/11 6:21 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.uberfoop 6/13/11 6:27 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/13/11 6:29 p.m.
                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/13/11 6:17 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.DHalo 6/13/11 6:48 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/13/11 7:10 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.DHalo 6/13/11 7:28 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/13/11 8:02 p.m.
                                                                                                           Re: You people are confusing me.DHalo 6/13/11 9:55 p.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/13/11 11:13 p.m.
                                                                                                                       Re: You people are confusing me.DHalo 6/13/11 11:50 p.m.
                                                                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/14/11 12:06 a.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.mnemesis 6/14/11 12:34 a.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/14/11 12:36 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.Louis Wu 6/14/11 7:21 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                     Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/14/11 1:22 p.m.
                                                                                                                                                           Re: You people are confusing me.Louis Wu 6/14/11 1:38 p.m.
                                                                                                                                                                 Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/14/11 2:30 p.m.
                                                                                                                                                                 Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/15/11 2:28 a.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.DHalo 6/14/11 12:38 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/14/11 12:44 a.m.
                                                                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.Stephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/14/11 6:19 a.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/14/11 6:26 a.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/14/11 6:55 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.Leviathan 6/14/11 9:46 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                     Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/15/11 2:31 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.General Vagueness 6/14/11 1:15 p.m.
                                                                                                                                                     Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/15/11 3:38 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                           Re: You people are confusing me.General Vagueness 6/15/11 10:09 p.m.
                                                                                                                                                                 Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/17/11 1:37 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: You people are confusing me.Avateur 6/14/11 1:28 p.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.DHalo 6/14/11 10:33 a.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/14/11 6:51 a.m.
                                                                             Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/14/11 1:14 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: You people are confusing me.Cody Miller 6/14/11 1:26 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: You people are confusing me.Narcogen 6/14/11 1:41 a.m.
                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLurono 6/9/11 3:42 a.m.
                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLurono 6/9/11 3:46 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/9/11 5:05 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLeisandir 6/9/11 10:04 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/10/11 2:23 a.m.
                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/9/11 5:04 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDHalo 6/9/11 9:04 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/9/11 12:02 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/10/11 2:27 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/10/11 6:28 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/13/11 1:13 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie Quotenomis78 6/13/11 2:43 a.m.
                                                                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/13/11 8:07 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/9/11 11:14 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/10/11 2:36 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLurono 6/10/11 9:44 p.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/13/11 1:27 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLouis Wu 6/13/11 11:07 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCody Miller 6/13/11 11:21 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLouis Wu 6/13/11 11:30 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCody Miller 6/13/11 11:39 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLouis Wu 6/13/11 11:41 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCody Miller 6/13/11 11:42 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteDarkS7G 6/13/11 11:55 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie Quotebluerunner 6/13/11 11:59 a.m.
                                                                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLouis Wu 6/13/11 12:04 p.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie Quotebluerunner 6/13/11 12:22 p.m.
                                                                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLeviathan 6/13/11 1:16 p.m.
                                                                                                                             I choose to believe this as well.Vandle Valsher 6/13/11 1:37 p.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: I choose to believe this as well.bluerunner 6/13/11 1:50 p.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: I choose to believe this as well.Beckx 6/13/11 3:20 p.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: I choose to believe this as well.Leviathan 6/13/11 1:53 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/14/11 12:58 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: Interesting Frankie Quotemnemesis 6/13/11 11:39 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteCody Miller 6/13/11 11:41 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: Interesting Frankie Quotemnemesis 6/13/11 11:52 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/14/11 1:02 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/14/11 1:01 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: Interesting Frankie Quotemnemesis 6/14/11 1:29 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/14/11 1:44 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/14/11 12:51 a.m.
                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/8/11 7:25 a.m.
                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteLurono 6/9/11 3:43 a.m.
                                               Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteSPARTAN-034 6/14/11 3:59 p.m.
                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteQuirel 6/14/11 4:33 p.m.
                                                     Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteFrankie 6/14/11 8:09 p.m.
                                                           Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/14/11 8:16 p.m.
                                                                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteFrankie 6/14/11 8:22 p.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteAvateur 6/14/11 8:39 p.m.
                                                                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteQuirel 6/14/11 9:17 p.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteStephen L. (SoundEffect) 6/14/11 9:28 p.m.
                                                                             In other news...GrimBrother One 6/14/11 10:31 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: In other news...mnemesis 6/14/11 10:55 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: In other news...macgyver10 6/15/11 1:16 a.m.
                                                                       AM I DOIN IT RITE?AngelicLionheart 6/14/11 10:07 p.m.
                                                                       Re: Interesting Frankie Quotemacgyver10 6/15/11 1:18 a.m.
                                                           Well, sufficiently advanced technology and all. :PSPARTAN-034 6/14/11 11:50 p.m.
                                   Love it! Make it happen 343i *NM*scarab 6/8/11 12:57 a.m.
                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteThe BS Police 6/8/11 8:13 a.m.
                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteArchilen 6/8/11 8:18 a.m.
                                               Re: Interesting Frankie Quotescarab 6/8/11 10:51 a.m.
                                         Re: Interesting Frankie Quote (Armour perms?)DEEP NNN 6/8/11 9:19 a.m.
                                               Re: Interesting Frankie Quote (Armour perms?)Revenant1988 6/8/11 10:51 a.m.
                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/9/11 1:10 a.m.
                                   Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteGeneral Vagueness 6/9/11 5:12 p.m.
                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteQuirel 6/9/11 5:41 p.m.
                       Re: Interesting Frankie Quotefrankie 6/7/11 8:58 p.m.
                             Do Sangheili even have Molars? *NM*INSANEdrive 6/7/11 9:07 p.m.
                             Re: Interesting Frankie Quotepete_the_duck 6/8/11 6:13 a.m.
                 well...kidtsunami 6/7/11 8:48 p.m.
                       Re: well...INSANEdrive 6/7/11 9:07 p.m.
                       Re: well...Chewbeccawacca 6/7/11 9:11 p.m.
                             Re: well...BanditORR 6/7/11 10:45 p.m.
                                   Re: well...Dagoonite 6/8/11 3:11 a.m.
                                   Re: well...Chewbeccawacca 6/10/11 12:18 p.m.
                                   Re: well...Louis Wu 6/13/11 10:48 a.m.
                             Interesting TheoryNsU Soldier 6/13/11 11:44 a.m.
                                   CONFIRMED!padraig08 6/13/11 12:37 p.m.
                                         Pre-order = DONE! *NM*Mazz 6/13/11 12:44 p.m.
                                         FURTHER CONFIRMED!Lekku 6/13/11 1:04 p.m.
                                               Re: FURTHER CONFIRMED!NsU Soldier 6/13/11 1:53 p.m.
                                         Re: CONFIRMED!Captain Spark 6/13/11 2:52 p.m.
                 I've never actually considered this until now.TCKaos 6/7/11 9:24 p.m.
                       Note: Don't think about something so much that ...INSANEdrive 6/7/11 9:43 p.m.
                             Re: Heh, I knew there'd be a reason...Tighclops 6/7/11 10:23 p.m.
                 Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteNarcogen 6/8/11 3:01 a.m.
                 Re: Interesting Frankie Quotespeak2al 6/10/11 6:56 a.m.
                       Re: Interesting Frankie Quotepete_the_duck 6/10/11 7:25 a.m.
                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteMazz 6/10/11 8:06 a.m.
                                   Re: Packing heat.Hedgemony 6/10/11 8:16 a.m.
                                         Re: Packing heat.bluerunner 6/10/11 9:02 a.m.
                             Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteMyyke 6/10/11 8:17 a.m.
                                   Re: Interesting Frankie Quotepete_the_duck 6/10/11 8:53 a.m.
                                         Re: Interesting Frankie Quotebluerunner 6/10/11 9:10 a.m.
                                         Re: Interesting Frankie QuoteMyyke 6/10/11 9:14 a.m.



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