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|Posted By: Quirel||Date: 12/28/12 6:15 p.m.|
In Response To: Stop with your logic (Cody Miller)
: None of that matters, because the sequence is so engaging. It's gripping
: emotionally, and it is effective.
Which isn't true for Halo 4.
-Where did this new armor come from?
: Plinkett's main criticism of Attack of the Clones is that Anakin is a whiny
"Truth is stranger than fiction. Fiction has to make sense."
But when an unlikely coincidence occurs or two characters get busy "Because the author says so", it's not as emotionally satisfying as events working out through the characters' own actions.
Otherwise, I agree that the editing and flow of that romantic development was terrible, and the whole thing could be salvaged with a different cut.
: Logic and coherence does not make a story good.
It makes it impossible for the audience to become emotionally involved.
The best stories I've enjoyed were complex, well-written, and had plenty of thought put into them.
I'm disappointed in Halo, because the story is becoming increasingly reliant on cheap tricks, and because artistic license rules the day.
The Order of the Stick is probably one of the best stories I've read, bar none. The characters are complicated, lovable, and the story never ceases to amaze me with how well it's been plotted. Events flow logically from one step to another. I don't have to sit back and puzzle over why, for example, the character's weapons change from one strip to another. I never have to invoke the MST3K Mantra.
Am I focusing on the wrong thing, because I enjoy both the emotional impact of the story and the effort that goes into this comic? I hope not.
'cause I'm an engineer.
: The Loftus approach is not how you get better stories, and it's not how you
Entertainment where you turn your brain off is not good entertainment.
What you're taking umbrage to is that people are getting hung up on "Little details" like the Warthog's brand spanking new suspension. You're saying that we're getting too logical about these details, and should be enjoying the emotional aspects of the story.
Well, as near as I can tell, the reaction to the MJOLNIR Mk. 343i and the new Forward Unto Dawn is just as emotional as it is logical.
The logical part is suspension of disbelief. I know that the Chief was wearing Mark 6 when he entered cryosleep. When he wakes up wearing the styrofoam leotard, a part of my brain is wondering "What?". It's trying to bridge what I know and what I see, and it's coming up short.
Instead of smoothly making the connection myself, 343i is standing off to the side and telling me "This actually is the Mark 6. This IS the Warthog you're looking for. These are the Grunts and Jackals you've known for so long."
Storytelling 101: Show, don't tell.
Now, there's the emotional part of the reaction to the changes.
But there's an emotional attachment I have to the characters, vehicles, guns and armor of Halo (what can I say? I'm a hardware junkie), and that attachment is strongest when I look at the Chief and realize that he is wearing Mark 6, not that he's supposed to be wearing Mark 6.
Lets continue with the Star Wars analogy. What if Lucas had replaced James Earl Jones with another voice actor? We would recognize that the guy in black is supposed to be Darth Vader, and maybe the new guy will do a pretty schnazzy voice on his own.
Now, how about logic getting in the way of emotional engagement?
"If reason cannot stop you, perhaps force can delay you."
Logically, it was a non-sequitor. The Didact never reasoned with us. From the git-go, he was an ugly brute of a villain determined to crush us and bring generic doomsday to Earth. He only ever used force.
If you want me to be emotionally invested in a villain, I need a logical reason to be invested. I need to know that the villain is a credible threat. I need to know that if he's not the brightest bulb on the chandelier, he's at least capable of laying down the hurt. I need to know that he is a clear and present danger to ME, not a million faceless civilians I never met.
Hell, I need a reason more original than "Save the Earth!" What am I, a Greenpeace activist?
Emotionally, Halo 4 had some high points, but that was all on Jen Taylor and Steve Downes. Even though they were shackled to a crew of mediocre writers, their performance was amazing.
The rest? Even with all the fancy mocap and rendering technology available to them, 343i's delivery was as subtle as an artillery strike, as skillful as a preschooler playing on a Stradivarius.
The point of this long, rambling post? Don't give credit to 343i for serendipity, and don't you dare sell logic short in telling a story.
|Stop with your logic||Cody Miller||12/28/12 1:49 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic *SP*||Jaydee||12/28/12 2:44 a.m.|
|I.. Uhhh.... Agree...? With.... You....||Lurono||12/28/12 3:22 a.m.|
|Also meant Adywan instead of Adi-Wan *NM*||Lurono||12/28/12 3:26 a.m.|
|Re: I.. Uhhh.... Agree...? With.... You....||Cody Miller||12/28/12 11:38 a.m.|
|Email sent *NM*||Lurono||12/28/12 8:56 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||uberfoop||12/28/12 3:22 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic *SP*||rhubarb||12/28/12 5:39 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||DEEP NNN||12/28/12 7:43 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Metalingus627||12/28/12 9:43 a.m.|
|I like this post. *NM*||SonofMacPhisto||12/28/12 10:58 a.m.|
|A nice hypothesis...||NsU Soldier||12/28/12 11:05 a.m.|
|Re: A nice hypothesis...||Cody Miller||12/28/12 11:31 a.m.|
|Re: A nice hypothesis...||Leisandir||12/28/12 11:53 a.m.|
|Re: A nice hypothesis...||SonofMacPhisto||12/28/12 11:55 a.m.|
|Re: A nice hypothesis...||Cody Miller||12/28/12 12:11 p.m.|
|Re: A nice hypothesis...||SonofMacPhisto||12/28/12 5:01 p.m.|
|Re: A nice hypothesis...||NsU Soldier||12/28/12 12:19 p.m.|
|This!||Chewbaccawakka||12/28/12 12:59 p.m.|
|The Loftus Approach||Leviathan||12/28/12 11:16 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/28/12 11:24 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||mc_leprechaun||12/28/12 11:27 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||The Lionheart||12/28/12 5:28 p.m.|
|Qouth the Falcon, "YES!" *NM*||NsU Soldier||12/28/12 11:33 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Cody Miller||12/28/12 11:35 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||SonGoharotto||12/28/12 11:38 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/28/12 3:09 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Cody Miller||12/28/12 3:22 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/28/12 5:56 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Cody Miller||12/29/12 12:47 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Cody Miller||12/29/12 1:26 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Simpsons Rule||12/29/12 1:56 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||uberfoop||12/29/12 5:15 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Simpsons Rule||12/29/12 2:49 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||uberfoop||12/29/12 9:46 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/29/12 9:52 p.m.|
|Talking about this? *IMG*||The Lionheart||12/30/12 4:54 p.m.|
|Re: Talking about this? *IMG*||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/30/12 5:52 p.m.|
|Ah, okay.||The Lionheart||12/30/12 6:03 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Gravemind||12/30/12 5:07 p.m.|
|Thank you for this post. *NM*||The Lionheart||12/30/12 4:15 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Ragashingo||12/29/12 2:42 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/29/12 11:21 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Cody Miller||12/29/12 11:56 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Leisandir||12/29/12 1:20 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Cody Miller||12/29/12 3:36 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Leisandir||12/29/12 3:38 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/29/12 9:38 p.m.|
|Same here. *NM*||The Lionheart||12/30/12 5:01 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/29/12 9:42 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Cody Miller||12/30/12 11:55 a.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/30/12 1:27 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||The Lionheart||12/30/12 5:25 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||Archilen||12/30/12 11:36 p.m.|
|Seconded. *NM*||The Lionheart||12/30/12 4:59 p.m.|
|Re: The Loftus Approach||SonofMacPhisto||12/28/12 5:19 p.m.|
|Wow, that sounds like my kinda guy!||The Lionheart||12/28/12 5:35 p.m.|
|Agree with this also. *NM*||The Lionheart||12/28/12 5:30 p.m.|
|*applauds* You're so awesome, Levi.||Gravemind||12/28/12 1:26 p.m.|
|TOOK THE WORDS OUT OF MY MOUTH *NM*||The Lionheart||12/28/12 5:28 p.m.|
|*Salute* *NM*||Quirel||12/28/12 5:40 p.m.|
|I don't disagree, but...||SonGoharotto||12/28/12 11:29 a.m.|
|My bad||SonGoharotto||12/28/12 11:36 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||scarab||12/28/12 12:09 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Cody Miller||12/28/12 12:14 p.m.|
|It wasn't emotionally compelling for me at all...||Phoenix_9286||12/28/12 1:21 p.m.|
|No.||Quirel||12/28/12 6:15 p.m.|
|Very well said, sir. *NM*||Leisandir||12/28/12 8:11 p.m.|
|As always, I agree with Quirel||Ibeechu||12/28/12 10:38 p.m.|
|Re: As always, I agree with Quirel||Cody Miller||12/29/12 1:18 a.m.|
|Re: As always, I agree with Quirel||scarab||12/29/12 5:02 a.m.|
|Not quite.||Quirel||12/30/12 3:15 a.m.|
|I know this is slightly OT, but . . . .||Leisandir||12/30/12 8:49 a.m.|
|Re: I know this is slightly OT, but . . . .||Quirel||12/30/12 1:50 p.m.|
|Re: No.||TDSpiral||12/29/12 12:09 a.m.|
|Re: No.||Quirel||12/30/12 3:33 p.m.|
|Re: No.||scarab||12/31/12 8:51 a.m.|
|This is the limbo that I find myself in now. *NM*||The Lionheart||12/30/12 4:04 p.m.|
|Re: No.||Cody Miller||12/29/12 1:04 a.m.|
|Re: No.||Flynn J Taggart||12/29/12 2:12 a.m.|
|Re: No.||Quirel||12/31/12 1:57 a.m.|
|Re: No.||uberfoop||12/31/12 4:18 a.m.|
|Re: No.||RC Master||12/31/12 8:59 a.m.|
|Your brain doesn't work the same way as mine. O_o *NM*||The Lionheart||1/1/13 5:08 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Kermit||12/28/12 10:59 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Ibeechu||12/28/12 11:57 p.m.|
|Consistency and the Rules of Two Worlds||NsU Soldier||12/29/12 7:06 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Leisandir||12/29/12 9:12 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||scarab||12/29/12 9:30 a.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Leisandir||12/29/12 11:08 a.m.|
|Tru dat||scarab||12/29/12 12:11 p.m.|
|Re: Tru dat||Leisandir||12/29/12 1:22 p.m.|
|Re: Tru dat||Cody Miller||12/29/12 3:37 p.m.|
|Re: Tru dat||Leisandir||12/29/12 3:39 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Kermit||12/29/12 3:33 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||Ibeechu||12/29/12 7:32 p.m.|
|Totally disagree||Avateur||12/29/12 1:04 a.m.|
|Re: Totally disagree||Stephen L. (SoundEffect)||12/29/12 11:30 a.m.|
|Re: Totally disagree||Avateur||12/29/12 1:47 p.m.|
|Re: Totally disagree||Kalamari||12/29/12 6:44 p.m.|
|It's dog food?||scarab||12/29/12 6:55 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic||General Vagueness||1/5/13 7:40 p.m.|
|Re: Stop with your logic *LONG*||Dundre||1/7/13 7:42 a.m.|
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