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Re: Tips for Reach
Posted By: Narcogen <narcogen@rampancy.net>	Date: 11/12/09 4:55 a.m.
In Response To: Re: Tips for Reach (Hawaiian Pig) : What part of "high skill ceiling" is hard to grasp? Why do so many : people here fight this concept so vehemently. I don't and I haven't. All I have stated on the subject is: 1) A higher skill ceiling is best implemented by additional higher difficulty levels, and 2) Bungie has already implemented about as many difficulty levels as it feels are appropriate. In addition there seems to be a perception that the proper way to tune difficulty is not by adjusting damage models and unit counts (and I agree) but with AI behaviors and, to a lesser extent, weapon characteristics. However there seems to be a perception that Bungie is pulling punches when it comes to AI behavior and I tend to disagree. I think the lens that makes H1 Elites seem "smarter" than H3 Brutes is largely nostalgia. I think the H3 AI is about as good as Bungie knows how to make, which is why getting difficulties above that is done with skulls, which are mostly adjustments to the damage model and other game attributes and behaviors, but not AI. The phrase "high skill ceiling" is not present anywhere in the message I was responding to. : It's in practically every. single. competitive. game. Many people mean different things by "competitive". Even with the inclusion of campaign scoring I don't really consider campaign "competitive" in the same sense that multiplayer is. : Hockey: easy to pick up and play with your buddies on the street, but try : getting into the NHL... : Football, Basketball, Baseball, etc. : Starcraft, Counter-Strike, Quake 3, etc. : Chess, Go, etc. I'm not sure I get it.. are you saying those games have a high skill ceiling, and Halo does not? Does that mean I can walk into an MLG event and walk out a champion if I get a little lucky? (I also note the venom reserved for events in Halo that are the results of random occurrences, and then I saw the weird carom off the boards that dribbled across the near post and clanged off the far one in front of Tim Thomas in the B's 3-0 win over the Pens the other day. Presumably that kind of randomness, as it does not directly reward skill, should be eliminated from the game-- the ref should've whistled the play dead, right?) Since the topic basically revolves around *campaign difficulty* I don't see how these multiplayer games are relevant *at all*. The "skill ceiling" in professional competitive sports is defined by the competition primarily, and only secondarily by the rules (size of playing field, size of goals, size of pads, regulations on equipment, etc etc). : "Hardcore" and "casual" players can play the same game : and get completely different things out of it. One is much harder to : design for than the other; but if you design for that one, you can please : both. No one is saying enjoyment from the game can only be attained from : being hardcore , no one in these arguments we always have here ever say : that. He is saying that. He is exactly saying that. See that sentence there he wrote? That's what it says. If he is saying this is true ONLY for him then it's a statement of little value in a thread largely about how Bungie should design their games-- hence the topic, "tips for Reach". : Let's take a look at what elessar said : This falls in line with the "high skill ceiling" concept. When applied to multiplayer, which was not the subject. : This is a personal statement to his approach to playing games . The argument was regarding campaign difficulties. The only possible relevance of his personal approach is to say that 1) Bungie should design the game around this approach and 2) other players should adopt his approach. : It could just as easily be "If I wind up below this threshold, oh well, : I like blowing stuff up and the engaging story." Freakin' kudos to : him if that were the case. : Could you seriously get this chip off of your shoulder about "those : damned hardcore guys trying to wave their dick around and tell everyone : they're better than everyone else." You're making that assumption, : we're not trying to express that; the response to elessar's post here is : so very telling of that. Actually, you are. You're saying you aren't because, you know, that's sort of rude. That those who are doing so are unwilling to admit to it is not particularly surprising. I note that Wu interpreted his post *exactly* the same way I did-- I actually wrote my response before I read his.

Anger, Sadness & Envy Episode 11: Halo

Message Index

Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/9/09 9:26 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Leisandir	11/9/09 9:33 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/9/09 9:36 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	serpx	11/9/09 9:38 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	InnerRayg	11/9/09 9:39 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Devin Olsen	11/9/09 9:46 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Crab	11/9/09 9:49 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	SPARTAN 294	11/9/09 9:56 p.m.
agreein with this post *NM*	Hawaiian Pig	11/9/09 10:02 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	InnerRayg	11/10/09 2:05 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/10/09 2:12 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/10/09 2:49 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/10/09 3:01 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/10/09 3:23 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/10/09 1:43 p.m.
Completely agree	Metalingus627	11/10/09 2:18 p.m.
Re: Completely agree	Narcogen	11/10/09 11:55 p.m.
Re: Completely agree	Metalingus627	11/11/09 3:52 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	11/10/09 3:00 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/10/09 5:25 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/10/09 11:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/11/09 2:20 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/11/09 5:17 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/11/09 2:32 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	chris101b	11/11/09 12:43 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/12/09 6:01 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	chris101b	11/13/09 1:27 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	InnerRayg	11/10/09 6:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hunt3r	11/9/09 9:55 p.m.
agreein with this post *NM*	Hawaiian Pig	11/9/09 9:59 p.m.
and a P.S. :	Hunt3r	11/9/09 10:02 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ragashingo	11/9/09 10:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Leisandir	11/11/09 3:05 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/9/09 9:55 p.m.
agreein with this post *NM*	Hawaiian Pig	11/9/09 10:00 p.m.
Would be better if it was actual AI doing that	RC Master	11/10/09 8:08 p.m.
Re: Would be better if it was actual AI doing that	Hedgemony	11/10/09 8:16 p.m.
Re: Would be better if it was actual AI doing that	RC Master	11/10/09 8:22 p.m.
Re: Would be better if it was actual AI doing that	Hedgemony	11/10/09 8:33 p.m.
Re: Would be better if it was actual AI doing that	RC Master	11/10/09 8:48 p.m.
Re: Would be better if it was actual AI doing that	Vincent	11/11/09 2:47 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	kanbo	11/9/09 10:04 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	dizzy	11/9/09 10:18 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Bernard Strauss	11/9/09 10:41 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach - my p.o.v.	Hedgemony	11/9/09 11:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach - my p.o.v.	Cody Miller	11/10/09 2:08 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach - my p.o.v.	SonofMacPhisto	11/10/09 9:24 a.m.
What have you started?	scarab	11/10/09 9:34 a.m.
Re: What have you started?	Louis Wu	11/10/09 9:38 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Captain Spark	11/9/09 10:29 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ragashingo	11/9/09 10:59 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Captain Spark	11/9/09 11:03 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/9/09 11:14 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hawaiian Pig	11/10/09 2:47 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Rosco-128	11/9/09 10:38 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/9/09 11:19 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Rosco-128	11/9/09 11:56 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/10/09 12:29 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Bry	11/10/09 8:47 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	scarab	11/10/09 9:48 a.m.
EEK ODST *SP* ^^^^ *NM*	scarab	11/10/09 9:50 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Metalingus627	11/10/09 2:24 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	The BS Police	11/9/09 10:40 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cortana 5	11/9/09 10:42 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	The BS Police	11/9/09 10:49 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cortana 5	11/9/09 10:56 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hawaiian Pig	11/9/09 11:00 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hunt3r	11/9/09 11:20 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/9/09 11:24 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hedgemony	11/9/09 11:04 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	ArteenEsben	11/9/09 10:47 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/9/09 11:29 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	ArteenEsben	11/10/09 10:38 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	RC Master	11/10/09 8:46 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ragashingo	11/9/09 10:48 p.m.
My Tip for Reach	ZaneZavin	11/9/09 11:21 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	bluerunner	11/10/09 9:45 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	11/10/09 10:50 a.m.
Make Reach (and any new IP) more like Marathon/H1	Avateur	11/9/09 11:03 p.m.
speaking of reach...	crzymnky069	11/9/09 11:07 p.m.
Re: Make Reach (and any new IP) more like Marathon	Narcogen	11/10/09 12:12 a.m.
Re: Make Reach (and any new IP) more like Marathon	Avateur	11/10/09 12:40 a.m.
Reachathon?	Narcogen	11/10/09 3:11 a.m.
Re: Reachathon?	Cody Miller	11/10/09 12:41 p.m.
Re: Reachathon?	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	11/10/09 1:37 p.m.
Re: Reachathon?	Hedgemony	11/10/09 2:19 p.m.
Re: Reachathon?	Cody Miller	11/10/09 3:26 p.m.
Re: Reachathon?	Narcogen	11/11/09 12:08 a.m.
Re: Make Reach (and any new IP) more like Marathon	Cody Miller	11/10/09 2:06 a.m.
Heresy!	Narcogen	11/10/09 3:30 a.m.
Re: Heresy!	Avateur	11/10/09 3:37 a.m.
Re: Heresy!	Narcogen	11/10/09 4:08 a.m.
Re: Heresy!	Cody Miller	11/10/09 12:26 p.m.
5 minutes to learn, a lifetime to master	RC Master	11/10/09 9:16 p.m.
Re: Heresy!	Narcogen	11/11/09 12:12 a.m.
Re: Make Reach (and any new IP) more like Marathon	Bry	11/10/09 7:18 a.m.
Adjustable Auto Aim	ManKitten	11/9/09 11:31 p.m.
Re: Adjustable Auto Aim	crzymnky069	11/9/09 11:49 p.m.
Re: Adjustable Auto Aim	urk	11/10/09 10:32 a.m.
Re: Adjustable Auto Aim	ManKitten	11/10/09 1:17 p.m.
Re: Adjustable Auto Aim	Gravemind	11/11/09 1:00 p.m.
Re: Adjustable Auto Aim	RC Master	11/10/09 9:21 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	reprobate	11/10/09 12:26 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/10/09 12:35 a.m.
First Person View!	Cody Moore	11/10/09 1:14 a.m.
Re: First Person View!	psychophan7	11/10/09 2:23 a.m.
Third Person View!	Narcogen	11/10/09 3:37 a.m.
Re: Third Person View!	bluerunner	11/10/09 9:27 a.m.
Re: Third Person View! Longish rant...	Hedgemony	11/10/09 2:05 p.m.
Re: Third Person View! Longish rant...	Cody Miller	11/10/09 2:59 p.m.
Re: Third Person View! Longish rant...	Hedgemony	11/10/09 4:35 p.m.
Re: Third Person View! Longish rant...	General Vagueness	11/10/09 4:06 p.m.
Re: Third Person View!	psychophan7	11/10/09 2:28 p.m.
Re: First Person View!	ArteenEsben	11/10/09 10:51 a.m.
Re: First Person View!	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	11/10/09 10:58 a.m.
Re: First Person View!	ArteenEsben	11/10/09 11:20 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/10/09 2:08 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Bungiez	11/10/09 1:09 a.m.
i wanna say this is kp *NM*	Hawaiian Pig	11/10/09 2:39 a.m.
Re: i wanna say this is kp	Louis Wu	11/10/09 8:30 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Someone	11/10/09 2:10 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	scarab	11/10/09 5:17 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Bernard Strauss	11/10/09 4:12 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	scarab	11/10/09 5:04 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	DrDoctor	11/10/09 2:14 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Bry	11/10/09 5:35 a.m.
Wort wort wort	Cody Moore	11/10/09 6:05 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	hyokin	11/10/09 10:25 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	Louis Wu	11/10/09 10:44 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	c0ld vengeance	11/10/09 12:36 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	Arkesane	11/10/09 12:47 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	padraig08	11/10/09 1:02 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	Avateur	11/10/09 12:47 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	c0ld vengeance	11/10/09 12:52 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	bluerunner	11/10/09 1:01 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	Louis Wu	11/10/09 1:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	FyreWulff	11/10/09 5:12 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach/Barrier Rant	psychophan7	11/10/09 2:02 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	urk	11/10/09 10:43 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/10/09 10:45 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	11/10/09 10:54 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/10/09 12:44 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/11/09 12:20 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hawaiian Pig	11/10/09 3:30 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	11/10/09 10:48 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/10/09 11:23 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	padraig08	11/10/09 1:20 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	RC Master	11/11/09 8:34 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/11/09 8:44 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	RC Master	11/11/09 9:58 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	RC Master	11/11/09 9:59 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/11/09 10:20 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/11/09 12:47 p.m.
•No barriers or kill zones anywhere in the game.	c0ld vengeance	11/10/09 12:03 p.m.
Wow, beat me to it.	profhalo	11/10/09 1:13 p.m.
Re: Wow, beat me to it.	Cody Moore	11/10/09 4:59 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/10/09 1:26 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Matt	11/10/09 3:44 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/10/09 3:50 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	SonofMacPhisto	11/10/09 4:26 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/10/09 4:39 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	nash--housewares	11/10/09 4:50 p.m.
At-least-semi-valid jackassery. *NM*	Eiii	11/10/09 7:11 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	ManKitten	11/10/09 8:37 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/11/09 12:24 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Matt	11/11/09 12:04 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/11/09 12:36 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	11/11/09 1:21 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ducain	11/11/09 1:28 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	ManKitten	11/11/09 1:29 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/11/09 10:37 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hedgemony	11/11/09 10:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Matt	11/11/09 2:11 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/11/09 3:12 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/11/09 3:46 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hunt3r	11/11/09 3:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/11/09 10:43 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hawaiian Pig	11/12/09 3:16 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Bry	11/12/09 3:39 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/12/09 4:55 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/12/09 12:38 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/12/09 12:45 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/12/09 12:54 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/12/09 1:05 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/12/09 1:22 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/13/09 1:20 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/13/09 2:54 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/13/09 4:16 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/13/09 2:53 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Mercury	11/13/09 4:03 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/13/09 11:21 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/14/09 12:57 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/12/09 2:24 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hedgemony	11/12/09 4:47 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Hunt3r	11/12/09 5:06 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/13/09 1:16 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/13/09 1:31 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/13/09 1:41 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Mercury	11/13/09 3:49 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/13/09 10:31 p.m.
Tips for arguments.	Mercury	11/12/09 5:41 p.m.
Re: Tips for arguments.	elessar787	11/13/09 1:29 a.m.
Re: Tips for arguments.	Mercury	11/13/09 3:35 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	RC Master	11/12/09 6:21 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/13/09 1:35 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/13/09 5:56 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/13/09 8:36 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/13/09 10:59 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/14/09 1:03 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/14/09 2:39 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/14/09 4:02 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/14/09 1:47 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	scarab	11/14/09 2:43 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/14/09 3:58 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/14/09 4:26 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/14/09 5:13 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/14/09 5:38 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Vincent	11/14/09 5:49 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/14/09 7:14 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Louis Wu	11/14/09 7:19 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	RC Master	11/14/09 11:56 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	11/14/09 12:36 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/13/09 1:28 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	elessar787	11/13/09 1:39 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Leviathan	11/12/09 6:29 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Bry	11/12/09 1:24 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Captain Spark	11/12/09 1:25 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/13/09 8:11 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	11/13/09 8:26 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/12/09 9:48 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	scarab	11/12/09 11:09 a.m.
"Accessable hardcore games."	Gravemind	11/12/09 8:29 p.m.
Re: "Accessable hardcore games."	scarab	11/13/09 5:16 a.m.
Re: "Accessable hardcore games."	Gravemind	11/13/09 12:30 p.m.
Re: "Accessable hardcore games."	scarab	11/13/09 2:23 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/12/09 9:46 a.m.
Pure Win, As Usual *NM*	Narcogen	11/11/09 12:22 a.m.
Two things	rhubarb	11/10/09 7:34 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Gravemind	11/11/09 2:19 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Gravemind	11/12/09 12:52 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ducain	11/12/09 10:30 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	General Vagueness	11/12/09 11:05 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Mirel	11/12/09 12:06 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ducain	11/12/09 1:21 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	zofinda	11/12/09 1:27 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	DarkS7G	11/12/09 1:54 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Mirel	11/12/09 3:08 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Metalingus627	11/12/09 3:25 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/13/09 1:53 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	scarab	11/13/09 5:56 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/16/09 2:26 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/16/09 2:38 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/16/09 2:48 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/16/09 12:03 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Leviathan	11/16/09 3:16 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/16/09 6:11 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/16/09 11:55 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ibeechu	11/16/09 12:19 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Ibeechu	11/16/09 12:21 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Dani	11/16/09 12:27 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/16/09 12:35 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Dani	11/16/09 12:43 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/16/09 2:18 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	psychophan7	11/16/09 3:01 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	11/16/09 2:16 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/16/09 2:24 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/16/09 9:04 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/16/09 9:56 p.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Narcogen	11/17/09 5:30 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	Cody Miller	11/17/09 12:45 p.m.
Framerate and buying habits	Narcogen	11/18/09 5:51 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	sorahn	11/17/09 1:59 a.m.
60 seems unreal anyway. Keep it 45 if you ask me	Mirel	11/16/09 3:19 a.m.
Bad idea	Narcogen	11/16/09 6:08 a.m.
Re: Tips for Reach	FyreWulff	11/16/09 6:54 a.m.