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Re: this
Posted By: Stephen L. (SoundEffect) <soundeffect@hotmail.com>	Date: 1/11/12 6:52 p.m.
In Response To: Re: this (Bry) : I wouldn't really include the game in that. At no point when playing the game : does one get the impression that the Sangheili haven't been around for the : entire war (take it from me, I played Halo and Halo 2 long before I read : the books, so it was actually rather strange and didn't seem to make a : whole lot of sense in that context. Just one of a number of reasons why : I'm wary of trusting them implicitly. Just the opposite in fact, everyone : seems rather used to seeing them. Be it the typical Marine, MC, Cortana or : Keyes). : To say it changed their character has its own flaws to be honest. : Essentially, the games were giving us the impression that the Sangheili were : always at the forefront of the Covenants military actions, especially in : Halo 2 and its deleted scenes (The Unggoy Rebellion, taming the Hunters, : etc). : When one has not been conditioned with the novels from the get-go, it doesn't : fit anywhere near as nicely (exactly why were Unggoy and Kig-Yar alone : doing such a good job of exterminating us, etc). : As a fan of the fiction and of the Sangheili, this was by far one of the most : important and worthwhile retcons the series has had. : For me, it re-opened the doors to more possibilities and ideas that FoR had : previous slammed shut in a rather crude, badly fitting manner. : While that is not to give all retcons a clean pass, this was one particular : area of contention that was never really clean cut, black and white. : So its the old Obi-Wan Kenobi cliché about points of view, etc. I fully agree that this point of view is hard to reconcile unless one experienced the novels prior to the game. I had read at least The Fall of Reach and the Flood before purchasing Halo PC in 2003, and First Strike before my Halo 2 purchase in late 2005. In Halo 1, we only saw the point of view of humans selected for Operation: RED FLAG. I would presume that once underway, they were briefed on Elites. By October 2552 (Halo 2) Elites were already old news. I only remarked about Halo 1 in that I don't think there's any dialogue by Marines, etc. to the effect that they've been fighting Elites for years; the juxtaposition of your comment that no one remarks that they're new either. The Taming of the Hunters and the Grunt Rebellion were internal to the Covenant. Well, in the Grunt's case, certainly, but in the Hunter's case the Hunters were out to be exterminated because they defiled Forerunner relics. It was because the Hunter eels couldn't be isolated and killed without the Covenant damaging Forerunner relics that an Elite Arbiter brought them into the Covenant fold. The Covenant had been just out to kill them off like Humans. And I don't think any more than 1 Arbiter (Elite) was even involved. I'm also not implying that the Elites didn't wage ground wars against other foes in the past. Perhaps those foes were worthy adversaries. I'm saying that the novels seemed to want us to know that it was humans specifically that Elites were disgusted with and that's the basis of their not being seen on human battlefields prior to 2552. That poison was crafted by the Prophets and seemed very pervasive, but it turns out some Elites questioned why humans weren't inducted into the Covenant in CFTU, which of course occurred during the Halo 2 timeframe when more Elites had had experience firsthand fighting humans. What you say was a door opened, I call a huge mess to reconcile ALL official material. I don't pick and choose my canon. All official Halo material is my canon and I would appreciate it if it all fit. As someone who's dedicated much of his free time for 7-8 years now trying to do just that, the parts that don't fit are beyond frustrating.

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Message Index

343I and the future of Halo.	ElzarTheBam	1/10/12 6:16 a.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	DEEP NNN	1/10/12 8:04 a.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	FoolsRun	1/10/12 8:44 a.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	General Vagueness	1/10/12 4:21 p.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/10/12 5:29 p.m.
this	davidfuchs	1/10/12 5:32 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/10/12 6:53 p.m.
Re: this	Quirel	1/10/12 11:16 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/11/12 6:25 a.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/11/12 11:27 a.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/11/12 12:03 p.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/11/12 12:11 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/11/12 1:08 p.m.
Re: this	Anton1792	1/11/12 3:12 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/11/12 5:13 p.m.
Re: this	Bry	1/11/12 6:29 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/11/12 6:52 p.m.
Re: this	Bry	1/11/12 7:28 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/11/12 8:08 p.m.
Re: this	Bry	1/12/12 6:15 a.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/12/12 6:44 a.m.
Re: this	scarab	1/12/12 2:49 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/12/12 3:48 p.m.
Re: this	Bry	1/12/12 4:05 p.m.
Re: this	scarab	1/12/12 5:23 p.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/13/12 10:23 a.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/13/12 11:14 a.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/13/12 12:05 p.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/12/12 5:16 p.m.
Re: this	Anton1792	1/11/12 9:31 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/11/12 10:23 p.m.
Re: this	Anton1792	1/12/12 5:27 p.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/12/12 5:00 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/15/12 4:47 p.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/15/12 5:29 p.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/15/12 7:13 p.m.
Re: this	General Vagueness	1/16/12 12:35 a.m.
Re: this	Bry	1/16/12 5:38 a.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/16/12 8:17 a.m.
Re: this	Leisandir	1/16/12 8:45 a.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/16/12 9:07 a.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/16/12 4:33 p.m.
Re: this	Bry	1/16/12 10:31 a.m.
Re: this	Stephen L. (SoundEffect)	1/16/12 11:27 a.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	General Vagueness	1/11/12 11:10 a.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	FoolsRun	1/11/12 7:25 a.m.
halomultiplayer.isnotcanon.net	scarab	1/11/12 7:31 a.m.
Re: halomultiplayer.isnotcanon.net	FoolsRun	1/11/12 7:53 a.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	General Vagueness	1/11/12 11:43 a.m.
Re: 343I and the future of Halo.	Flynn J Taggart	1/11/12 1:20 p.m.
the comments they're responding to	kidtsunami	1/10/12 4:12 p.m.
The one thing 343i needs to do:	Azo 'Galvat	1/11/12 12:03 a.m.