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Re: I think that it's a systematic adjustment
Posted By: kidtsunami <davidandrewhelmer@gmail.com>Date: 12/4/11 5:55 p.m.

In Response To: Re: I think that it's a systematic adjustment (uberfoop)


: True, but whether the risk pays off or not is still to a good extent due to
: the coordinated performance of your team and that of the other team.
: Obviously there are still factors totally outside the control of the
: players, as is inevitable in the real world, but it's usually kept to a
: minimum. To a pretty good extent, you can still trace the coordinated
: actions of the teams and players as more or less deterministically leading
: to a result.

I just really don't agree. It's not deterministic and if it was it wouldn't be nearly as interesting to watch or discuss afterwards. Actually the games that are the most deterministic are often the least discussed or interesting.

I can't tell you how many live sporting events I've walked out on because of how clearly the other team was better, even the ones where it was the team I was going for. I'm here to watch a game, not a dry demonstration of who is better for hours. There's no drama and nothing to really get excited about as a spectator.

: You can't just "think" that the randomness due to bloom is a
: "systematic adjustment," unless every player in the game is
: shooting so slowly that the error is completely eliminated, which never
: happens. It is, in the strictest sense, random error*. There is nothing to
: play against. The results are not completely determinable strictly by
: following player actions and their expected results. It's not even a
: question; the uncertainty in a confrontation between two DMR'ing players
: is random error. Obviously players need to account for this error
: tactically (which is what you seem to have thought I mean by
: "systematic adjustment"), but then, you'd have to
: "tactically" account for the face-punching random guy in a track
: meet as well (and by "tactically" I mean "get really good
: at being punched in the face").

poker players are exceptionally good at getting punched in the face. Actually the best pro poker players are extremely good at handling the occasional face punching

: *Well, okay, it's a pseudorandom algorithm. Computers would of course have to
: use something crazy like nuclear decay measurements to get a true
: random**. But that's waaaaay beyond the scope of what a human player is
: going to know or have any sort of actual control over.

I reckon casinos are rainmanning their way to true randomness. I always just take the current millisecond as my seed usually, since a person who could game that would be pretty awesome.

: **And a few weird theories of quantum mechanics argue that even that isn't
: true random. Physics is weird.

Yes it is. Having gotten out when we started talking about spin, I'm always on the fence about whether or not everything is deterministic.


Message Index




Replies:

MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?RVideo 12/2/11 7:45 p.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Spec ops Grunt 12/2/11 8:18 p.m.
           Whoa now!!!bryan newman 12/2/11 8:57 p.m.
                 Re: Whoa now!!!JDQuackers 12/2/11 9:32 p.m.
                       Re: Whoa now!!!bryan newman 12/3/11 12:24 a.m.
                             Re: Whoa now!!!RVideo 12/3/11 1:05 a.m.
                                   Re: Whoa now!!!Bryan Newman 12/3/11 4:35 p.m.
                                         Re: Whoa now!!!Bry 12/3/11 5:06 p.m.
                                               Not quite trueBryan newman 12/3/11 5:41 p.m.
                                                     Re: Not quite trueBry 12/3/11 6:38 p.m.
                                                           That really depends.uberfoop 12/3/11 6:46 p.m.
                                                                 Err, wait.uberfoop 12/3/11 6:48 p.m.
                                                           MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.bryan newman 12/3/11 7:42 p.m.
                                                                 "Casual Weapons"Spec ops Grunt 12/3/11 8:07 p.m.
                                                                       I'm not trying to be insulting.bryan newman 12/3/11 8:29 p.m.
                                                                             Re: I'm not trying to be insulting.SonofMacPhisto 12/3/11 8:33 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: I'm not trying to be insulting.bryan newman 12/3/11 8:41 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: I'm not trying to be insulting.SonofMacPhisto 12/3/11 8:45 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: I'm not trying to be insulting.bryan newman 12/3/11 8:47 p.m.
                                                                                         Pro = paid. Amateur = not paid.Gravemind 12/5/11 4:12 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: I'm not trying to be insulting.Bry 12/3/11 9:12 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: I'm not trying to be insulting.SonofMacPhisto 12/3/11 10:18 p.m.
                                                                                               OopsSonofMacPhisto 12/3/11 10:24 p.m.
                                                                                         It's my gamerzone...RC Master 12/4/11 8:10 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: It's my gamerzone...Bry 12/4/11 9:57 a.m.
                                                                 Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.Bry 12/3/11 8:24 p.m.
                                                                       Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.SonofMacPhisto 12/3/11 8:32 p.m.
                                                                       Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.bryan newman 12/3/11 8:38 p.m.
                                                                             Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.Bry 12/3/11 9:06 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.bryan newman 12/3/11 9:21 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.Leviathan 12/3/11 9:39 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.bryan newman 12/3/11 9:56 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.Leviathan 12/3/11 10:09 p.m.
                                                                                                           Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.uberfoop 12/3/11 10:44 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.ZaneZavin 12/4/11 2:50 a.m.
                                                                                                           Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.Bryan Newman 12/4/11 10:03 a.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.ZaneZavin 12/4/11 10:46 a.m.
                                                                                                                       Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.Bryan newman 12/4/11 12:21 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: MLG is not a requirement, merely a perk.Bry 12/3/11 10:02 p.m.
                                                                 Re: Hey NewmanHedgemony 12/3/11 9:43 p.m.
                                                                       Re: Hey Newmanbryan newman 12/3/11 9:53 p.m.
                                                                             Re: Hey NewmanHedgemony 12/3/11 10:14 p.m.
                                                                                   MLG: Hire Hedge.Leviathan 12/3/11 10:29 p.m.
                                                                                   Thispadraig08 12/3/11 11:26 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: ThisHyokin 12/4/11 11:10 a.m.
                                                                                               Sourcedpadraig08 12/4/11 2:13 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: SourcedHyokin 12/4/11 9:10 p.m.
                             Re: Whoa now!!!JDQuackers 12/3/11 7:37 a.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?davidfuchs 12/2/11 9:13 p.m.
                 Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?SIX min WHISTLE 12/2/11 10:21 p.m.
                 Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Azo 'Galvat 12/3/11 12:11 a.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Pkmnrulz240 12/2/11 9:27 p.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?DEEP NNN 12/2/11 9:42 p.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/2/11 9:53 p.m.
                 Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?SonGoharotto 12/2/11 10:30 p.m.
                       Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/2/11 10:37 p.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?DEEP NNN 12/3/11 5:54 a.m.
                                   Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/3/11 11:15 a.m.
                                         Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?DEEP NNN 12/3/11 2:40 p.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?JDQuackers 12/3/11 7:49 a.m.
                                   Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/3/11 11:00 a.m.
                                         Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?JDQuackers 12/3/11 5:26 p.m.
                                         Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Spec ops Grunt 12/3/11 8:11 p.m.
                                               Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Flynn J Taggart 12/4/11 5:24 a.m.
                                                     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Spec ops Grunt 12/4/11 2:20 p.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/2/11 9:50 p.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?davidfuchs 12/2/11 10:26 p.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?urk 12/3/11 1:13 a.m.
                 Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/3/11 1:45 a.m.
                       Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?urk 12/3/11 10:19 a.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Azo 'Galvat 12/3/11 10:31 a.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/3/11 11:30 a.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?padraig08 12/3/11 2:32 p.m.
                 Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Spec ops Grunt 12/3/11 2:15 a.m.
                 Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?FyreWulff 12/3/11 4:25 a.m.
                       Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?GhaleonEB 12/3/11 8:11 a.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?FyreWulff 12/3/11 8:36 a.m.
                       Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Schooly D 12/3/11 10:44 a.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Joony Joon 12/3/11 11:38 a.m.
                                   exactlykidtsunami 12/4/11 4:26 p.m.
                                         Re: exactlyuberfoop 12/4/11 4:51 p.m.
                                               I think that it's a systematic adjustmentkidtsunami 12/4/11 5:23 p.m.
                                                     Re: I think that it's a systematic adjustmentuberfoop 12/4/11 5:44 p.m.
                                                           Re: I think that it's a systematic adjustmentkidtsunami 12/4/11 5:55 p.m.
                                                                 Re: I think that it's a systematic adjustmentuberfoop 12/4/11 6:27 p.m.
                                                                       we'll have to hedge itkidtsunami 12/4/11 6:46 p.m.
                                                                             Re: we'll have to hedge ituberfoop 12/4/11 7:17 p.m.
                                                           Re: I think that it's a systematic adjustmentAnton P. Nym (aka Steve) 12/4/11 7:13 p.m.
                                                                 Re: I think that it's a systematic adjustmentuberfoop 12/4/11 7:31 p.m.
                                               I forgot to saykidtsunami 12/4/11 5:24 p.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Overdoziz 12/2/11 10:37 p.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Pkmnrulz240 12/2/11 11:41 p.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Leviathan 12/3/11 12:28 a.m.
                 Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?bluerunner 12/3/11 2:26 a.m.
                       Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?SonofMacPhisto 12/3/11 10:20 a.m.
                             Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?ArteenEsben 12/4/11 6:50 a.m.
                                   Twilight Sparkle?RC Master 12/4/11 8:40 a.m.
                                         Re: Twilight Sparkle?Ibeechu 12/4/11 9:07 a.m.
                                               Horsemeat? *NM*Quirel 12/4/11 10:08 a.m.
                                               Re: Twilight Sparkle?Leviathan 12/4/11 12:06 p.m.
                                                     =Othebruce0 12/4/11 6:47 p.m.
                                                           Re: =OLeviathan 12/5/11 4:32 p.m.
                                                     O_OHotIcePhoenix 12/4/11 11:19 p.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Quirel 12/3/11 1:02 a.m.
           Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?SonofMacPhisto 12/3/11 11:08 a.m.
     Adding my vote to the "Don't Care" column. *NM*Phoenix_9286 12/2/11 11:15 p.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Flynn J Taggart 12/3/11 1:54 a.m.
     So I watched quite a bit...RC Master 12/3/11 5:52 a.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?NartFOpc 12/3/11 12:23 p.m.
     Re: MLG and Halo: Is this the end of the road?Kalamari 12/3/11 2:08 p.m.
     Bloom is not the blue shellkidtsunami 12/4/11 4:47 p.m.



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