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Damn, Sept.
Posted By: Shishka	Date: 10/1/06 7:12 p.m.
In Response To: Re: Um. (Sep7imus [subnova]) : Oh yeah, remember Shishka (and his little sister Shiska)? He used to come : around her sometimes... Oh dear god. Worst. Typo. Ever. Who taught you english, Prof? Anyhow, I'm not sure what you'd expect KP, myself, or anyone to say, really. There's an interesting pattern emerging, here, in which anytime something major happens around Bungie, a group of fans speak of their (former) dedication to the company, how the decisions Bungie has made have put a pox on their record, that Bungie is betraying/neglecting the wishes of the fan community, that Bungie doesn't care anymore, and that they, as formerly dedicated fans, have lost all faith in Bungie and can no longer see Bungie being successful, as they've chosen to ignore the "fans that made them what they are," etc etc. I recently re-read a transcript from IRC, when Max Hoberman and Matt Soelle attempted to answer questions about the Microsoft acquisition. The pattern was startlingly similar. A number of people asking the right questions, and a number of people demanding to know "how could you do this to your fans," "when did Bungie start caring about nothing but money," "I've lost all faith in you," blah, blah, blah... It's like a broken record that takes five or six years before skipping. The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the people going off the handle about losing faith weren't even around at the time the acqusition was announced. This isn't because Bungie ate its own community and then spent the years struggling trying to rebuild it; it's because Halo was so huge that the community supernova'd into something exponentially larger than it had ever been before. And then, again when Halo 2 was released, despite the number of people claiming that if the game didn't meet their expectations, the community, Halo 2, and Bungie itself would collapse and be dead. At the time of the acquistion, jilted fans exclaimed with fists airborne that allowing Microsoft to acquire Bungie and allowing them to make Halo primarily an Xbox title was the worst decision ever made. The brilliant reality is that it is possibly the most devastatingly good call in Bungie history. It brought the developer of some pretty kick ass titles to an incredibly larger audience, and brought that same audience into the family known colliquially as the "Fan Community." Who are you, myself, or anyone to say, then, that Bungie is going to "murder" its franchise by expanding the universe into other mediums? It's not like we don't know what we're doing, or that we're being careless; we're not "settling" for anyone or anything, here. We've got one of the best RTS developers in the industry working on Halo Wars. Peter (goddamn) Jackson on not one, but two Halo projects (the movie and the vaguely-announced Wingnut Interactive project, before someone tries to twist my words). Does it look to anyone like we're sparing any expense? I realize this is a bit off track, but bear with me, I'll reply to MarineCorp117 directly in a moment. The people that are panicking about "too much Halo" are, in my opinion, being a bit ridiculous. All that matters, the ONLY THING that actually matters, is that the end results are fun and enjoyable. There could be 20 Halo titles, and if they all kick ass, then YAY, there are 20 titles! You folks should be less concerned over your personal interpretation of how the Industry works and more concerned with the projects themselves. Trying to decide whether Halo Wars will be good or bad right now is like trying to decide the entirety of Halo 2's story from its announcement trailer. Although the pre-rendered video was pretty, you still haven't seen anything from Halo Wars proper, yet. Be patient, and wait for the real content to start trickling in. And if it looks bad/looks like it isn't your thing? Don't buy it, don't pick it up, whatever. Remember the good ole days when you would happily own every Halo title ever (both of them, them), and move on. Now, to respond to the thread that prompted this rant. MarineCorps117's fears (and indeed, the fears of many of you) tend to be rooted mainly in assumptions and generalizations. For example: "All video game movies suck." Sure. But why? Actually look at what made a movie bad, and compare what went wrong to what's being done for the Halo movie. The irony here is that you can't, actually, because we're being quiet about the movie right now. Your issues about the Graphic Novel are really your own opinion, and you are welcome to them. I should point out that things settled upon as "hard fact" by the fanbase are usually determined as such by the fanbase with no prompting by Bungie. An obvious example of this are the number of people that have concluded that the Drinol and the Sharquoi are the same thing, simply because they haven't seen them mentioned anywhere other than in Halo 2 related discussion. Fans call the Spec Ops Commander "Half-Jaw," and have accepted this as his name, but Bungie generally calls him "Spec-Ops Commander." A less obvious example, I suppose, would be that Maria was able to leave active duty and start a family. To underline that you're allowing your opinion to blur your distinction between assumption and canon, I'll point out that your comment about nobody but an NBA player being willing to see (let alone start a family with) Maria is clearly your own personal opinion, and a bit snide at that. The reality is that not every Spartan II is John-117, and not every Spartan II walks the same path as the Master Chief. They may have been augmented and futzed with in many ways, but they're still human. As for the Elites in Infinite Succor, I'd think that someone so hung up on Halo canon would be aware that Elites have spoken in such a manner since the very beginning. They've always been religious zealots in character. Just because you only heard them say "wort wort wort" in Halo 1 doesn't mean they weren't calling you a demon. With typical Shishka flair, I'm going to point out that I was inclined not to bother replying to this thread when I read the comment about the last line from the Halo Wars trailer, as though the last line of a pre-rendered announcement trailer defines the gameplay for a game you haven't seen yet. That stuff turns on my "ignore" subroutines. However, the irony I've come to realize here is that, even though I have chosen to reply, I have nothing to say to you. You are welcome to pass judgement on a title you know little about. I can't really stop you from ceasing your participation in the fan community, either. Bet you didn't expect this reaction, did you? But the fact of the matter is that you're looking for some kind of reaction of fear or apology from Bungie, because you aren't 100% sure that you like the decisions we've made. Unfortunately, we're too busy making another kick ass video game to satisfy the desire fans seem to have to feel that they control Bungie, as though that has ever been the case. It's a shame if you "lose your faith," in Bungie, but Bungie fans can sleep well at night knowing that our games aren't powered by faith, but by a team of the best damn people in the industry shedding blood, sweat and tears over their work. So, I guess, to put my opinion more succinctly, it's a shame for any fan to decide to walk away from the community, but I think that at least you should wait until an intelligent judgement on all of this can genuinely be made. Specifically, that'll be when it's sitting in front of you. When that time comes, try hard to remember what is subjective and what isn't. And for god's sake, quit acting like your dedication was "wasted" if you don't like something we do. Not liking one game doesn't mean all the fun you've had with other games is magically erased. Nor does it mean the game or games you preferred are suddenly gone. In the meanwhile, we'll continue making awesome games. Hopefully, you'll be there to participate in the fun. -S

Message Index

Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo film	MarineCorps117	10/1/06 4:42 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	Grunt_Lover	10/1/06 5:18 p.m.
Um.	Peptuck	10/1/06 5:42 p.m.
Re: Um.	Sep7imus [subnova]	10/1/06 5:43 p.m.
worst typo ever *NM*	Document	10/1/06 6:37 p.m.
Worst? or best? *NM*	Peptuck	10/1/06 6:54 p.m.
Best Placed *NM*	Unsc Trafalgar	10/1/06 6:59 p.m.
Re: worst typo ever	Sep7imus [subnova]	10/1/06 7:05 p.m.
Damn, Sept.	Shishka	10/1/06 7:12 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Sep7imus [subnova]	10/1/06 7:37 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	MarineCorps117	10/1/06 7:37 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	raptor117	10/1/06 7:51 p.m.
"racism in science fiction" *NM*	Document	10/1/06 8:27 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	10/1/06 8:08 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Count Zero	10/1/06 8:10 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	10/1/06 8:14 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Sir Blunt	10/1/06 8:12 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Peptuck	10/1/06 8:37 p.m.
I've got a word	Hikaru-119	10/1/06 8:51 p.m.
Re: I've got a word	Peptuck	10/1/06 8:55 p.m.
Re: I've got a word	Schedonnardus	10/1/06 8:55 p.m.
Re: I've got a word	Sep7imus [subnova]	10/1/06 9:48 p.m.
Re: I've got a word	Schedonnardus	10/1/06 10:12 p.m.
in that spirit: troops. *NM*	Document	10/1/06 11:19 p.m.
Re: in that spirit: troops.	Andrew Nagy	10/1/06 11:21 p.m.
Re: in that spirit: troops.	ShortRoundMcfly	10/2/06 12:43 a.m.
Re: in that spirit: troops.	Document	10/2/06 12:45 a.m.
Re: I've got a word	HipboyScott	10/1/06 10:29 p.m.
the dude abides *NM*	Schedonnardus	10/1/06 10:40 p.m.
Re: I've got a word	Peptuck	10/1/06 10:42 p.m.
dude, where's my dropship? *NM*	Schedonnardus	10/1/06 10:44 p.m.
Flood's in your base, killing your d00ds. *NM*	Peptuck	10/1/06 11:38 p.m.
Soylent Green is d00dz! *NM*	Schedonnardus	10/1/06 11:54 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Gordon Freeman	10/1/06 9:23 p.m.
Hmm	Hawaiian Pig	10/1/06 8:19 p.m.
*sheds a tear*	Hikaru-119	10/1/06 8:40 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Cody Miller	10/1/06 10:14 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	mercury	10/2/06 5:49 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Narcogen	10/1/06 10:27 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Shishka	10/2/06 12:16 a.m.
I fully disagree...	DanteThePoet	10/2/06 12:51 a.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Endbringer	10/2/06 1:03 a.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	10/2/06 10:28 a.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Narcogen	10/3/06 12:39 a.m.
Here here. As shishka said.. have faith! *NM*	Littlebigman	10/1/06 11:08 p.m.
Re: Damn, Sept.	Brodingo	10/2/06 4:45 p.m.
Oy.	MarineCorps117	10/2/06 5:19 p.m.
Re: Oy.	mercury	10/2/06 5:37 p.m.
Re: Oy.	MarineCorps117	10/2/06 6:24 p.m.
Re: Oy.	Peptuck	10/2/06 7:26 p.m.
Re: Oy.	MarineCorps117	10/2/06 7:30 p.m.
Re: Oy.	Mister Froggy	10/2/06 7:21 p.m.
Re: Oy.	Peptuck	10/2/06 7:25 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	slayer117	10/2/06 10:42 a.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	Baz	10/2/06 10:53 a.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	Peptuck	10/1/06 5:40 p.m.
Its all about the Benjamins	BeastIce	10/1/06 6:07 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	WortWortWort	10/1/06 6:22 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	MarineCorps117	10/1/06 7:28 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	Peptuck	10/1/06 8:39 p.m.
that's easy	GhaleonEB	10/1/06 7:10 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	Dojorkan	10/1/06 8:32 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	BARBARIC RAGE	10/1/06 9:05 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	jman571	10/3/06 8:09 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	catsinspace	10/1/06 9:52 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	ShortRoundMcfly	10/1/06 10:37 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	[AMS] GreyThor	10/1/06 11:43 p.m.
Re: Yeah, man	ShortRoundMcfly	10/1/06 11:59 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	Rox	10/2/06 3:04 a.m.
Go outside sometime. *NM*	Paul	10/2/06 1:23 a.m.
Always half empty with some *NM*	Grey Wolf	10/2/06 2:07 a.m.
Dual-wielding shotguns = Marathon	Chryton	10/2/06 3:21 a.m.
Here's a novel concept...	yakaman	10/2/06 7:26 a.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	mnemesis	10/2/06 10:56 a.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Baz	10/2/06 11:03 a.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Marine Corps 117	10/2/06 1:25 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Anton P. Nym (aka Steve)	10/2/06 1:47 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Louis Wu	10/2/06 1:53 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Document	10/2/06 1:54 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	mercury	10/2/06 2:05 p.m.
Agreed. *NM*	Document	10/2/06 2:18 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	MarineCorps117	10/2/06 2:58 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Sep7imus [subnova]	10/2/06 3:25 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Peptuck	10/2/06 3:49 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	Sep7imus [subnova]	10/2/06 4:19 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	yakaman	10/2/06 4:19 p.m.
Re: Here's a novel concept...	[AMS] GreyThor	10/2/06 4:26 p.m.
question for the Bungie guys	Angel_251	10/2/06 3:04 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	Sep7imus [subnova]	10/2/06 3:27 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	Angel_251	10/2/06 4:04 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	Peptuck	10/2/06 3:52 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	Angel_251	10/2/06 4:05 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	KP	10/2/06 4:51 p.m.
I guess you missed the memo... *NM*	Usul	10/2/06 5:06 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	Ross Mills [subnova]	10/2/06 5:40 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	mercury	10/2/06 5:42 p.m.
Re: question for the Bungie guys	Angel_251	10/2/06 5:51 p.m.
Re: Why I've lost faith in Bungie and the Halo fil	Twelve Large	10/3/06 12:33 a.m.