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Look, a good rational response! ^_^
Posted By: Xian	Date: 1/22/00 11:39 a.m.
In Response To: Re: Unreliable... poor argument (Mark Levin) Mark Levin never lets me down! Thanks, this is probably the best response thus far as most of the previous arguments boil down to "Because Bungie said so" (which they didn't) or "Cuz they are" (not a particularly compelling argument). For ONCE someone actually pointed out that it's not Bungie's style to go "official" in the first place! However. This does not prove that there are cyborgs in Halo. > One thing to keep in mind is that the fact that the Marathon > Marine was a cyborg (and yes, this is definitely a fact, and > yes, it has been confirmed by Bungie) was not revealed until the > end of the game; and even then it was not general knowledge > until Hamish Sinclair analyzed the story very carefully. Perhaps > there's a reason Bungie's being so vague about this particular > fact. I know the Mararthon Marine was a cyborg... and I understand that this was a fact that had to be speculated upon. Which is *EXACTLY* what I'm trying to say. People are going on faith that the Halo marines are cyborgs... not proof. They accept it as gospel. I'm simply saying there's room for the marines NOT to be cyborgs as well! And a lot of people have been shooting me down as if they can't accept that. > But that aside, almost every other piece of evidence points to > the Marines being cyborgs. It's already very nearly a given (the > Marathon logo, the deliberate lack of dates, the general > background of the Halo universe) that Halo takes place in the > Maraverse, with the story starting between M1 and M2. Earth > already has the technology to build enhanced warriors, so why > wouldn't they use it here? Again, it's good evidence, good to have a belief... but, there's room for a Non-cyborg theory as well, right? In Marathon, there were only a select few cyborgs while everyone else was plain old human (be they military or not). Simply because you have the technology doesn't mean you use it (many reasons, be they political, personal rights, discrimination against organics, economical, etc.)... otherwise, present day troops would be maxed out on the hottest technology! ;) If the cyborgs are not undead soldiers then I imagine getting cybernetic implants is a matter of choice. That also lowers, possibly, the number of cyborgs. Or, for all we know, willingly choosing cybernetics are taboo in human culture as well. Again, I think it's possible that your squad might all be made up of cyborgs... but that doesn't remove the possibility that they AREN'T either! > The Marines very closely resemble the > Marathon Marine as rendered by Craig Mullins, whether this is > intentional or not is unclear. They display great strength and > agility (hanging onto a moving jeep at high speed, long jumps > and falls, the ability to be a threat to modern combat armor > while wielding a knife, etc.) Far from being the key piece of > evidence, Bungie's use of the word "cyborg" would come > as a postscript rather than the body of the fact. Right. It might be awhile if at all- before we hear "cyborg" from their lips... so until then all we can do is speculate. So saying there are "no cyborg humans" can be as valid as everyone else's faith in the "all cyborgs" theory. btw, their superhuman feats could possibly be the result of power armor... I'm not saying that they are, simply that the option is open. And, if you think about it, in a lot of ways, power armor is a lot better technology than cybernetic. Because armor is modular and can be exchanged and can be repaired while the soldier still operates... meanwhile, if you're cybernetic eye is glitching you're out of combat until they fix it. Nor can you go around, swapping body parts with other people (based on the <20% cyborg of Marathon). To me, at least externally, the Covs look more cyborg than the human troops! I mean, you look at the Halo humans and say they look like the Marathon Marine... fine! But guess what? To us, he was a cyborg... but to everyone else he was a marine! Remember, they said that cyborgs looked indistinguishable from normal humans (as he lived covertly amongst them)... so if a normal human marine today looks like a cyborg that looks like a normal human marine in Marathon- that proves nothing! Again, there's a window for all human or mostly human marines.

Message Index

No cyborgs in Halo...	Xian	1/21/00 7:20 p.m.
Re: No cyborgs in Halo...	Myndreach	1/21/00 7:27 p.m.
Almost... not quite	Xian	1/21/00 7:34 p.m.
Re: Almost... not quite	Draeger	1/21/00 7:43 p.m.
Overthinking?	Xian	1/21/00 7:54 p.m.
Re: Overthinking?	Draeger	1/21/00 8:19 p.m.
You're overthinking...	Xian	1/21/00 9:21 p.m.
Re: You're overthinking...	Jägermeister	1/22/00 12:33 a.m.
Unreliable... poor argument	Xian	1/22/00 1:17 a.m.
Re: Unreliable... poor argument	Mark Levin	1/22/00 3:11 a.m.
Re: Unreliable... poor argument	Scorpio	1/22/00 9:27 a.m.
Re: Unreliable... poor argument	Remix	1/22/00 1:02 p.m.
Re: Unreliable... poor argument	Desio	1/22/00 3:04 p.m.
It kind of boils down to THIS:	Jägermeister	1/22/00 9:56 p.m.
Re: It kind of boils down to THIS:	Desio	1/23/00 9:02 a.m.
Re: It kind of boils down to THIS:	Jägermeister	1/23/00 4:19 p.m.
Re: It kind of boils down to THIS:	Scorpio	1/23/00 4:47 p.m.
Re: It kind of boils down to THIS:	Mark Levin	1/23/00 6:16 p.m.
Look, a good rational response! ^_^	Xian	1/22/00 11:39 a.m.
I have been away to long	Desio	1/22/00 12:02 p.m.
Re: Unreliable... poor argument	hakkikt	1/22/00 4:10 a.m.
Re: Unreliable... poor argument	Dan Rudolph	1/22/00 8:35 a.m.
but....	Magh Tuireadh	1/22/00 11:49 a.m.
Re: You're overthinking...	Louis Wu	1/22/00 8:24 p.m.
Re: Almost... not quite	Dan Rudolph	1/22/00 8:29 a.m.
Re: Almost... not quite	ZeroRage	1/22/00 6:44 p.m.
Re: Almost... not quite	Mage	1/22/00 6:48 p.m.
Re: Almost... not quite	ZeroRage	1/23/00 8:24 p.m.
Re: Almost... not quite	8Delicious	1/24/00 11:15 a.m.
Re: No cyborgs in Halo...	Mark Levin	1/21/00 7:49 p.m.
The only one?	Xian	1/21/00 7:59 p.m.
Re: That is confirmation I think....	Draeger	1/21/00 8:21 p.m.
Re: The only one?	Ben Schodek	1/21/00 11:22 p.m.
Odd jump in logic...	Xian	1/21/00 11:38 p.m.
Re: The only one?	Dan Rudolph	1/22/00 8:28 a.m.
Re: The only one?	Louis Wu	1/22/00 8:16 p.m.
omg	Scuttle	1/22/00 12:04 p.m.
Re: omg	Mark Levin	1/22/00 1:10 p.m.