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Re: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)
Posted By: maxthehedgie <>Date: 4/13/07 9:45 p.m.

In Response To: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued) (mrbananas)

: Additions from Halo Graphic Novel

: From the Last voyage of the infinite succor Non-sentient animals keep in a
: hunting preserve on board the covenant ship become infected by the flood.
: Not only does this prove that Cognitive capabilities doesn't mean
: sentience, but it also supports my claim that the halo ring must target
: based upon sufficient biomass and not sentience. Since non-sentient
: animals can be infect by the flood, in order for halo to effectively work
: it could not be a weapon that only kills sentient life forms. This also
: strikes a hard blow at the possibility for separate race of Reclaimers to
: have survived Halo's activation due to being under evolved to just below
: sentience. Human ancestors would have been a potential vector.

: Also from the same story is support that the Flood operate as a collective
: mind that can communicate amongst themselves. This comes from the fact
: that once team mates were infected the Flood were able unlock doors and
: use the codes to access all of the ships systems. This collective
: capability to think also points toward the flood as a sentient species
: considering that the flood is capable of reading knowledge from a hosts
: mind and then being able to apply it and share it amongst its comrades,
: all of which are then able to apply it. While anyone can train a dog, its
: different story to see dogs sharing technological information a between
: themselves and teaching each other advanced concepts and ideas.

: From Second Sunrise over New Mombassa a Covenant Elite says this: 32
: "We need to clear this area before we can secure access to The
: Ark"

: This confirms that the ark is indeed on earth and that is in or near New
: Mombassa.
: Considering that the halo 3 trailer takes place in New Mombassa we can
: conclude that the forerunner structure seen either is the Ark or is some
: how related to the Ark. This also confirms that the prophet of Regret’s
: reasons for coming to Earth was because he was looking for the Ark and
: that it was most likely that the Covenant learned about earth's
: coordinates simply because it was the recorded location of an important
: Forerunner structure. The Covenant probably did not know about the name of
: the planet that the ark was on or the fact that the planet was humanities’
: home world.

: *SPOILERS* Ghost of Onyx

: I have keep all pieces of evidence in regards to Onyx separate from the main
: bulk because firstly the main bulk was written before GoO and also because
: some people have not read the book yet. While everything above is capable
: of standing on its own, everything below only adds to. The events from GoO
: can be applied in many different ways and a deeper look into the events
: occurring there can be made for now I am just going to look at the things
: which affect the ancient past of Halo, not the present time politics.

: 33 The drone crept closer. His own voice blasted though his helmet’s
: speaker: “Fhejelet’Pnught Juber.”
: Ash shook his head clear. “I don’t understand.” He held up his hands spread
: wide and shrugged – the universal I-don’t-know gesture.
: “Fhejelet non sequitur, now?”
: “I got part of that,” Ash said. “Non sequitur- that’s Latin, right?” Pg 133

: In quote #33 a Sentinel confronts one of the Spartan IIIs and speaks to him.
: What I found interesting is that the default language spoken has speakable
: words, vs. being something completely alien like high pitched squeals or
: barking or etc… Think about it for a second. Humans are capable of
: producing billions of different sounds from our tongue. As a result we
: have tons of different foreign language. While I can’t understand Chinese,
: they are still words/sounds capable of being reproduced by my tongue. The
: fact that the sentinel is speaking understandable words somewhat supports
: that possibility that the forerunner language is just another human
: foreign language. Considering that if humans are forerunners, since the
: tongue has not changed, then both should be capable of speaking the others
: language. The fact that the sentinel spoke Latin in seeking a base
: language is also surprising. What’s even more surprising is that the
: sentinel understood the universal I-don’t-know gesture which is universal
: amongst humans.

: What’s even more surprising about the Latin is that it spoke it perfectly,
: without ever hearing Latin spoken to it. If someone spoke Spanish to you,
: I would find it odd if managed to then perfectly speak Spanish without any
: prior history with the language, or even the languages spoke by the human
: race. While Latin my not have been the language of the forerunners, this
: goes to show that the sentinels have had enough knowledge about the
: various types of languages or tongues can produce and being able to
: recognize a specie’s and its capable languages by just a brief listening
: sample.

: 34 “Non sequitur,” it said. “reclassification of targets as non-Reclaimers.
: Aboriginal subspecies. Collect for further analysis-else neutralize as
: possible infection vector.” Pg. 133

: In quote #34 the biggest thing is the use of the term subspecies. For those
: of you who don’t know the scientific meaning behind subspecies, subspecies
: are groups of organisms which are still members of the same species and
: capable of interbreeding to produce fertile offspring. In essence dog
: breeds are subspecies since different breeds can intermix to produce
: hybrid offspring.

: By calling Ash a subspecies, Ash is still a member of the same species as
: Reclaimers. Why is Ash called a subspecies? Part could be due to his
: ignorance of anything forerunner, but it could also be due to his
: augmentation. Unlike the Spartans II’s, the third company of Spartan IIIs
: underwent special augmentations of the brain to give them an increased
: bestial instinct during periods of great stress in order to improved the
: Spartan III’s survival rate.

: 35 She bent closer to the last pod and ran her fingers over the forerunner
: icons along its side, translating as she did so: “ ‘That which must be
: protected…behind the sharpened edge of the shield…beyond the reach of the
: swords…for the reclaimed.’ No, that’s not quite the correct meaning.”
: “Reclaimed…” Ash echoed. “Maybe ‘Reclaimer’?” Pg. 337

: 36 Holographic icons swarmed over the control surface. Voro read them,
: shouting the divine passage to his soldiers: “The dark times are upon
: us…Unsheathe thy swords and smite… The Ark will be your guide …And bless
: the reclaimers that may take refuge behind the sharpened edge of the
: Shield …Wonder beyond awaits.” Pg 351

: 37 “If all this is true, Doctor,” Fred said, “and the Forerunners built
: this as a refuge, a bomb shelter to protect from the Halos or the Flood,
: then why aren’t they here?”
: Dr. Halsey shrugged and uttered the words no one thought her capable of: “I
: don’t know.” She closed her laptop. “Did something go wrong with their
: plan? Or did everything go as planned? We may never know. Why the Flood
: survives today and where the Forerunners went are complete mysteries we
: have yet to solve.” Pg 381

: 38 “When you said the Forerunner translation for Onyx was ‘shield world,’”
: he whispered, “that was a literal translation, wasn’t it?” Pg 276

: 39 “There’s so much here,” Dr. Halsey whispered. “I’ve confirmed this world
: is part of the Forerunners’ plan together with Halo rings – their ‘sword’
: and ‘shield.’ Other parts still elude me. There is a reference to the
: ‘ark.’ I have yet to determine if something went wrong…why they are not
: here.” Pg 310

: In Quote #39 and #37 it gets clearly established that Halo, Onyx, and the Ark
: are all part of one bigger plan and each plays an important role in it.
: When originally just looking at the Halos, from the first Halo game, the
: only plan that could be seen was that the halos were a weapon of mass
: destruction for wiping out the flood. However we know now that there was
: far more to this plan than just defeating the flood. Onyx shows that a
: part of the much bigger forerunner picture included self preservation as
: well and not just complete sacrifice of the entire Forerunner race to
: defeat a foe.

: When you look at all of the above quotes, Onyx is called a shield world. Halo
: was originally called a fortress world but now is being called a sword.
: Where does this place the Ark in the grade scheme of things?

: Well in quote #36, the Covenant’s translations call the Ark a guide. Going
: back, to the original theory, if the human race truly are the forerunners,
: then Ark in part would seem like some sort of means for guiding the
: Reclaimers/new forerunners back to all of their abandoned technologies
: which are scattered across the galaxy so that they can go reclaim them
: quickly. The Prophet of Regret discovered the location of Delta Halo while
: he was on earth looking for/investigating the Ark. The Ark or some ruins
: around it, told Regret exactly where to find a Halo ring. The Ark is a
: road map to the Forerunner’s Halo rings. It is also the backup emergency
: failsafe for remotely activating the Halo rings should they fail to fire
: on their own. The Ark is already known for these important features but is
: there more? If Onyx is the starting location for the new Forerunner race
: called the Reclaimers then why would the Ark be located so far away? How
: is the emergency failsafe going to be useful if the forerunner are
: bunkered down and hiding else where, especially when threats like the
: flood could easily end up standing in between Onyx and the Ark?

: 37 “If all this is true, Doctor,” Fred said, “and the Forerunners built
: this as a refuge, a bomb shelter to protect from the Halos or the Flood,
: then why aren’t they here?”
: Dr. Halsey shrugged and uttered the words no one thought her capable of: “I
: don’t know.” She closed her laptop. “Did something go wrong with their
: plan? Or did everything go as planned? We may never know. Why the Flood
: survives today and where the Forerunners went are complete mysteries we
: have yet to solve.” Pg 381

: 39 “There’s so much here,” Dr. Halsey whispered. “I’ve confirmed this world
: is part of the Forerunners’ plan together with Halo rings – their ‘sword’
: and ‘shield.’ Other parts still elude me. There is a reference to the
: ‘ark.’ I have yet to determine if something went wrong…why they are not
: here.” Pg 310

: In quotes #37 and #39 Halsey establishes the possibility of failure in the
: forerunners big picture plan, just like I already suggested early on.
: However, before we can establish if the plan was a failure our not we need
: to know what the plan is and how all the parts fall together. To this I
: have several possibilities.

: Right away some of you might have already questioned the need for Reseeding
: process as described early now that we have an established shield for
: keeping adults alive. While this might be true, there is also still room
: for the reseeding. For starters, let us not forget that Humanity started
: on earth, the location of the ark, not Onyx. If all Reclaimers were to
: have originated from Onyx or some other shield world, they would have to
: of somehow gotten to earth and then completely forgotten their quest.
: While not entirely impossible, it is also not supportable by anything
: except imaginative speculation.

: We also can’t forget about the rest of the galaxy either. The forerunners and
: flood are not the only ones being wiped out by Halo and thereby needing to
: be preserved. Onyx might be great for keeping one sustainable planet’s
: worth environment and animals alive, but certainly not all life in the
: galaxy. There could be more Onyx like worlds out there, but then there is
: also the increased difficultly of capturing and containing live adults
: over unborn children. Every single adult is going have its own individual
: needs which need to be fore filled all through out capture, transfer to
: shield world, waiting time, and transfer back, where as an embryo can just
: be put on ice and takes up far less space than sustainable populations of
: adults. Also don’t forget about production costs and labor available
: during this major period of galactic crisis with the flood wars. On top of
: producing 7 halo super weapons across the galaxy, adding to that the Ark,
: trying to build an onyx for every planet with life forms on it would be
: very extreme.

: However Onyx exist and plays an important role and so here are a couple of
: different simplified examples of what the master plan could have included:
: -Reseeding process and Onyx combo. The Ark is used as a means to store and
: then reseed the entire galaxy after the halo activation. On Onyx, a few
: surviving forerunner adults and possibly even a few adult organism (to
: remove nannybot to some degree) would leave Onyx after reseeding to teach
: the larger new forerunner group all of the old culture and technology and
: knowledge that would have otherwise been lost by the reseeding process
: alone. This would not only prevent the old way of life from being
: forgotten, it could also speed up the rate of Reclaiming. The mighty
: Forerunner Empire would also be able to get back on its feet much earlier.

: Also note that it would be more important for the failsafe for remote
: activation to be with the ark and not Onyx. The Ark would be more
: important because at least through the reseeding process alone the galaxy
: and the forerunners would be able to be reborn after Halo’s activation
: where as The small Group on Onyx alone would not be able to effectively
: restart life in the galaxy. In the end the scale weighs life vs. knowledge
: tipped in life’s favor. As for the Error, there could have been a mistake
: in the location of the ark, the survival of the Onyx members, or both or
: something else all together.

: -Reseeding process alone, with Onyx as a failed experiment. We can not
: confirm that the forerunners ever actually hide inside of Onyx or that is
: say use during activation or Halo. Onyx could have been developed first
: and built, only then later abandoned for the Ark idea or could have been
: found that it wouldn’t have actually worked. However, considering that
: Onyx is still mentioned within the bigger forerunner plans, this is least
: likely. It is still possible that the error from the previous example
: could have simply been that the forerunners never made it to Onyx in time
: before activation for unforeseen reasons.

: -Onyx without Reseeding. Reseeding seems entirely possible to be done within
: the halo universe but that doesn’t mean it was ever used or considered.
: However, let it stand that Humans = forerunner is not dependant upon the
: reseeding process. The Forerunners survival can then just be explained by
: using Onyx and then somehow coming to earth. Either way there is still a
: possible way by which the forerunners could have survived Halo. Waste your
: efforts on ensuring so other species survival when those same efforts
: could be used to save your own species.

: -The Ark as a shield world like Onyx. Sort of a sub branch of the previous
: example but also going farther by making the Ark exactly the same as Onyx
: as an explanation as to why humanities starting location is the Ark and
: not the surface of Onyx. However, this is also speculation and also
: becomes difficult to explain how the earth could have been shield world
: all these years and also this would require to the Sentinels to be going
: berserk on Earth at the same time as they are on Onyx. Since Onyx timeline
: overlaps the war on earth when the other Spartans are summoned from earth
: to answer the distress on Onyx this seems highly unlikely.

: mrbananas’s Final Remarks

: Without this final section, the theory alone has stretched out to 24 Word
: document pages. You might be saying, wow mrbananas this is nice work, or
: geez this guy has no life. But as the title implied, this is the last halo
: theory I am going to ever write. So I wanted to make sure I said
: everything I was going to say in a completely formalized manner.

: I would just like to state on my defense that this entire theory was not
: written all at once but was started a year ago with progression going on
: and off repeatedly. Also, around completion it then just sat around for
: another several months. The majority of the ideas were taken from all the
: previous theories I have written and put into a more organized and unified
: form. While a big part of the theory revolves around humans being
: forerunners, most of the other parts and pieces are capable of standing
: alone and applicable in may other paths of speculation.

: Considering that it is a big, long theory, chances are that some questions
: might be getting answered in other sections. Don’t assume that when you
: see someone point out a disagreement that they have thoroughly checked the
: entire piece. The answer to their rebuttal might just lie hidden somewhere
: inside. I also acknowledge that many quotes are open to more than just the
: one interpretation I chose. Chances are that I am not going to be around
: to answer many questions

: As far as I am concerned, I don’t even care if the theory turns out to be
: completely wrong. I have given my personalized educated “guess”, (emphasis
: on guess) and will be happy if even only a tiny section turns out to be
: only somewhat close to the truth. I am always open to the realm of
: possibilities and I don’t plan on having a mental break if I turn out to
: be wrong. If you have read this far then I thank you for taking the time
: to do so.

Well, I was close to this in my own theories. Not nearly as through, but close. My fan fiction will need some revizing, as this is superior to my own work. I thank you for providing this- I never would have known to make the corrections without it. I'm proud to say I only have this to do, though:

-Switch non-sentient human ancestor with Ark-as-shield concept.
-Replace all instances of Forerunner constructs using the word "human" with something out of the Forerunner language.
-Anything else I pick up on as I revise.

Sweet! A million times, thank you- and kudos for your perceptiveness and overall genius.

Message Index


mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)mrbananas 4/5/07 2:26 p.m.
     mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)mrbananas 4/5/07 2:29 p.m.
           BrilliantHikaru-119 4/13/07 3:20 p.m.
                 Re: BrilliantDHalo 4/13/07 3:47 p.m.
                       Re: BrilliantHikaru-119 4/13/07 4:00 p.m.
                             Re: BrilliantDHalo 4/13/07 4:02 p.m.
                             Re: BrilliantCthulhu117 4/13/07 4:02 p.m.
                                   Re: BrilliantHikaru-119 4/13/07 4:04 p.m.
                                         Re: BrilliantDHalo 4/13/07 4:06 p.m.
                                               Ah, yes...Cthulhu117 4/13/07 4:15 p.m.
                                                     Re: Ah, yes...mrbananas 4/13/07 7:40 p.m.
                                                           oh great!ActiveCamoElite 4/13/07 10:42 p.m.
                                                                 Re: oh great!mrbananas 4/14/07 12:58 p.m.
                                                                       the first great jouney! *NM*ActiveCamoElite 4/14/07 3:40 p.m.
           My thoughts exactlyHawaiian Pig 4/13/07 7:14 p.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)maxthehedgie 4/13/07 9:45 p.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)UrsusArctos 4/14/07 8:23 p.m.
                 Re: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)mrbananas 4/14/07 11:26 p.m.
                 Re: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)reprobate 4/22/07 6:25 a.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)Guscon 4/15/07 10:36 a.m.
           To the end of arc, Mr Bananasyakaman 4/16/07 1:54 p.m.
                 Re: To the end of arc, Mr BananasUrsusArctos 4/22/07 8:03 a.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 2 (continued)Davis Beutler 7/16/07 8:21 a.m.
     Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)Ragashingo 4/5/07 11:09 p.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)7isdarker 4/13/07 6:20 p.m.
                 Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)Cthulhu117 4/13/07 7:17 p.m.
     Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)Quantum 4/13/07 8:31 p.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)Quantum 4/13/07 8:34 p.m.
     Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)BINARYGOD 5/28/07 7:11 p.m.
     Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)BINARYGOD 5/29/07 12:09 a.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)mrbananas 5/29/07 4:02 p.m.
     OH, I get it now.Izzinatah 5/29/07 12:58 a.m.
           Re: OH, I get it now.BINARYGOD 5/29/07 1:25 a.m.
                 Re: OH, I get it now.doober187 5/29/07 5:20 a.m.
     Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)Druff 5/29/07 2:35 p.m.
           Re: mrbananas last theory part 1 (long)Tyler Koharik 7/25/07 10:48 p.m.
     One ProblemPak 6/24/07 11:39 a.m.
           Re: One Problem*-^Ghosts-of-Onyx^-* 6/24/07 9:42 p.m.

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