Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View


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Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View

Posted By: Steve Levinson Date: 8/30/04 5:09 a.m.
In Response To: Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View (Dr. John Sumner)

Oops - sorry about the accidental empty post
: No! No! No! Matt and Andrew don't remove it! Steve, the defining point of
: this level is to use the jetpack. That's why this level is there. I
: believe you when you say that it can be vid without using the jetpack. But
: anyone wishing to view this film might very well be viewing it to see how
: to get through it with the jetpack. I vote to leave it there. Remove it
: and a vid film just wouldn't be the same.
What's the fun in flying over a bunch of monsters? OK, I understand that it's fun to fly, but there really is no challenge whatsoever in vidding this level with the jetpack. Obviously it's at the player's discretion to use it or not, but having a fresh jetpack right there in front of you when you enter the level is, well, a major disappoingment for me - it kind of makes the torture of Newton seem wasted. As a compromise, how about putting the jetpack directly under the player - that way it wouldn't be quite so obvious unless you went back for it, but the vidder would be assured of having it. Now, back to the idea of vidding without the jetpack. John, have you tried it? Trust me - it's a good vid and unlike flying over the monster's heads, a decent challenge.
: Ok, let's take these rooms one at a time. The opening room is certainly large
: enough to fight with fists or anything else a player would want to use.
: However, since the projectile fighters regenerate with a fairly high
: frequency, I find myself not wanting to spend much time in this room. Yes,
: there is a PB here and I am glad for that. However, except for saving, the
: room is totally uninspiring (from a fighting point of view). Having to
: deal with those projectile fighters every time I come into the room is
: annoying. Annoying like having gnats in your face.
Or wasps as the case may be? ;^) Now where have I heard this before? Frankly I find there's a big difference between infinitely regenerating wasps and infinitely regenerating fighters. You have to take on the wasps because they won't let you alone. The fighters, on the other hand, can be safely ignored except when they get in the way of your exit from the PB. I'm perfectly comfortable with the fighters in this room and basically just ignore them - they'll never catch me. Perhaps Matt or Andrew could add some interesting visuals here to make the room more worthwhile - maybe a slime pool or something - I dunno.
: The second room is the only room where I enjoy the action. Fighting those
: compilers is fun for me. There is plenty of room to circle them and a 2x
: recharger to reward your efforts at the end.
Agreed - the second room is a good fight.
: The third room is a complete mystery to me. Why in the world is it there? Why
: in the world would anyone want to go into this room? There are no
: rechargers, or PB's, and not even a way out other than the plasma stream
: surrounding it. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the only
: feasible way to proceed after the 2x recharger is to jump into the plasma
: stream and avoid the room altogether. Is that really what Matt and Andrew
: had in mind? This room was meant to be one big tease? Or one big ammo
: waste? Or one big shield waste? Let's just say that I was disappointed
: when I first encountered this part of the level.
Also agreed, which is Why I suggested doing something with it. The player at minimum shouldn't be penalized for going there and preferentially should get a reward. I would favor making the door on the other side a working door - a good player should be able to survive the room with minimal ammo or shield drain and, thus emerge from it better off than if they swam in the plasma. A small ammo cache wouldn't be a bad idea, either, but I find on TC that I generaly have way more ammo than I need to finish the game.
: As for the last room, it's certainly impressive with all of the monsters and
: all it's beauty. But the Juggs are immune to each other's attack. I know
: because I checked the physics of the jugg. In fact, it's immune to the
: Magnum, AR, and Fusion Gun. Given those circumstances, if I decide to stay
: around and fight, then it's going to take possibly alot of time, possibly
: alot of ammo from the Missile Launcher and Faser, I am going to risk
: what's left of my 2x shields, and even then I am going to have to hope
: there aren't any enforcers in the hallway once I do try to make it to the
: exit. And to top it off, I am then going to have to HOPE that I can
: survive the opening of "Omega". And that is no sure bet since
: that level has a fairly difficult opening. Otherwise if I die in the
: process, guess what? I have to start all the way back at that PB at the
: beginning of Room for Rent. So, the strategy that makes most sense to me
: is to jump down into the plasma, immediately head for the hallway next to
: the enforcers, hope there are none there, and hope I can survive the
: opening of Omega. Fortunately, it doesn't take too long to decide whether
: I succeed in all of that or not.
It's really a shame, because I think this room could be a lot of fun if there were more to do. As I stated before, getting through it quickly is a better than even bet, and that's the first thing that should be changed. Whether it's by having an exit door that opens slowly or by adding or moving some monsters, the player shouldn't be able to leave quite so quickly. Secondly, there needs to be a PB and probably a shield recharger down here. Now, John, this area isn't nearly as dangerous to the player as you seem to think it is, as there is a solid wall to provide defensive cover and having the rocket launcher mounted on your right shoulder means you can fire at the juggers without significantly exposing yourself - er, maybe I should put that another way. ;^) In any case, the problem is that it takes too long to kill the juggers, there is no way to save your game and no way to recover from a miscalculation. A PB and shield recharger on the outside of that wall would get us half-way there. Making the juggers susceptable to their own weapons would go the rest of the way - they're not immune to your rockets, so why should they be immune to theirs? Removing jugger self-immunity could lead to some pretty spactacular fireworks, and why not? Remove their immunity to the enforcers and we might get them to take out most of the enforcers for us, too. There I think you have the fix to this room. Perhaps to compensate for making it a lot easier, Matt and Andrew could add some additional monsters in the final room - nothing major, but enough to keep the player on their toes.

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: Oops - sorry about the accidental empty post : What's the fun in flying over a bunch of monsters? OK, I understand that it's : fun to fly, but there really is no challenge whatsoever in vidding this : level with the jetpack. Obviously it's at the player's discretion to use : it or not, but having a fresh jetpack right there in front of you when you : enter the level is, well, a major disappoingment for me - it kind of makes : the torture of Newton seem wasted. As a compromise, how about putting the : jetpack directly under the player - that way it wouldn't be quite so : obvious unless you went back for it, but the vidder would be assured of : having it. Now, back to the idea of vidding without the jetpack. John, : have you tried it? Trust me - it's a good vid and unlike flying over the : monster's heads, a decent challenge. : Or wasps as the case may be? ;^) Now where have I heard this before? Frankly : I find there's a big difference between infinitely regenerating wasps and : infinitely regenerating fighters. You have to take on the wasps because : they won't let you alone. The fighters, on the other hand, can be safely : ignored except when they get in the way of your exit from the PB. I'm : perfectly comfortable with the fighters in this room and basically just : ignore them - they'll never catch me. Perhaps Matt or Andrew could add : some interesting visuals here to make the room more worthwhile - maybe a : slime pool or something - I dunno. : Agreed - the second room is a good fight. : Also agreed, which is Why I suggested doing something with it. The player at : minimum shouldn't be penalized for going there and preferentially should : get a reward. I would favor making the door on the other side a working : door - a good player should be able to survive the room with minimal ammo : or shield drain and, thus emerge from it better off than if they swam in : the plasma. A small ammo cache wouldn't be a bad idea, either, but I find : on TC that I generaly have way more ammo than I need to finish the game. : It's really a shame, because I think this room could be a lot of fun if there : were more to do. As I stated before, getting through it quickly is a : better than even bet, and that's the first thing that should be changed. : Whether it's by having an exit door that opens slowly or by adding or : moving some monsters, the player shouldn't be able to leave quite so : quickly. Secondly, there needs to be a PB and probably a shield recharger : down here. Now, John, this area isn't nearly as dangerous to the player as : you seem to think it is, as there is a solid wall to provide defensive : cover and having the rocket launcher mounted on your right shoulder means : you can fire at the juggers without significantly exposing yourself - er, : maybe I should put that another way. ;^) In any case, the problem is that : it takes too long to kill the juggers, there is no way to save your game : and no way to recover from a miscalculation. A PB and shield recharger on : the outside of that wall would get us half-way there. Making the juggers : susceptable to their own weapons would go the rest of the way - they're : not immune to your rockets, so why should they be immune to theirs? : Removing jugger self-immunity could lead to some pretty spactacular : fireworks, and why not? Remove their immunity to the enforcers and we : might get them to take out most of the enforcers for us, too. There I : think you have the fix to this room. Perhaps to compensate for making it a : lot easier, Matt and Andrew could add some additional monsters in the : final room - nothing major, but enough to keep the player on their toes.

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PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Steve Levinson	8/29/04 7:37 p.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Dr. John Sumner	8/30/04 3:14 a.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View NM	Steve Levinson	8/30/04 4:40 a.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Steve Levinson	8/30/04 5:09 a.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Dr. John Sumner	8/30/04 7:14 a.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Steve Levinson	8/30/04 5:14 a.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Dr. John Sumner	8/30/04 10:28 a.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Steve Levinson	8/30/04 12:19 p.m.
Re: PF Volunteers - Their Gamla/Room with a View	Little Kago	8/30/04 1:51 p.m.



	Your Name:
	Your E-Mail Address:
	Subject:
	Message: : Oops - sorry about the accidental empty post : What's the fun in flying over a bunch of monsters? OK, I understand that it's : fun to fly, but there really is no challenge whatsoever in vidding this : level with the jetpack. Obviously it's at the player's discretion to use : it or not, but having a fresh jetpack right there in front of you when you : enter the level is, well, a major disappoingment for me - it kind of makes : the torture of Newton seem wasted. As a compromise, how about putting the : jetpack directly under the player - that way it wouldn't be quite so : obvious unless you went back for it, but the vidder would be assured of : having it. Now, back to the idea of vidding without the jetpack. John, : have you tried it? Trust me - it's a good vid and unlike flying over the : monster's heads, a decent challenge. : Or wasps as the case may be? ;^) Now where have I heard this before? Frankly : I find there's a big difference between infinitely regenerating wasps and : infinitely regenerating fighters. You have to take on the wasps because : they won't let you alone. The fighters, on the other hand, can be safely : ignored except when they get in the way of your exit from the PB. I'm : perfectly comfortable with the fighters in this room and basically just : ignore them - they'll never catch me. Perhaps Matt or Andrew could add : some interesting visuals here to make the room more worthwhile - maybe a : slime pool or something - I dunno. : Agreed - the second room is a good fight. : Also agreed, which is Why I suggested doing something with it. The player at : minimum shouldn't be penalized for going there and preferentially should : get a reward. I would favor making the door on the other side a working : door - a good player should be able to survive the room with minimal ammo : or shield drain and, thus emerge from it better off than if they swam in : the plasma. A small ammo cache wouldn't be a bad idea, either, but I find : on TC that I generaly have way more ammo than I need to finish the game. : It's really a shame, because I think this room could be a lot of fun if there : were more to do. As I stated before, getting through it quickly is a : better than even bet, and that's the first thing that should be changed. : Whether it's by having an exit door that opens slowly or by adding or : moving some monsters, the player shouldn't be able to leave quite so : quickly. Secondly, there needs to be a PB and probably a shield recharger : down here. Now, John, this area isn't nearly as dangerous to the player as : you seem to think it is, as there is a solid wall to provide defensive : cover and having the rocket launcher mounted on your right shoulder means : you can fire at the juggers without significantly exposing yourself - er, : maybe I should put that another way. ;^) In any case, the problem is that : it takes too long to kill the juggers, there is no way to save your game : and no way to recover from a miscalculation. A PB and shield recharger on : the outside of that wall would get us half-way there. Making the juggers : susceptable to their own weapons would go the rest of the way - they're : not immune to your rockets, so why should they be immune to theirs? : Removing jugger self-immunity could lead to some pretty spactacular : fireworks, and why not? Remove their immunity to the enforcers and we : might get them to take out most of the enforcers for us, too. There I : think you have the fix to this room. Perhaps to compensate for making it a : lot easier, Matt and Andrew could add some additional monsters in the : final room - nothing major, but enough to keep the player on their toes.
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