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Re: Xboxes vid card
Posted By: Timothy Wilson <tim@somewhocallme-tim.net>Date: 9/28/01 5:53 p.m.

In Response To: Xboxes vid card (Riley)

: So the Xbox isn't going to have a Ge-force3??? Shit now as a PC gamer I
: can't match their card.

The NV2A inside the xbox is almost the same core as a GF3.
Supposedly there are '2' vertex shaders, but I'm not sure how 2 could be used.
I have a hunch that this is really the fixed function pipeline being confused with the VS hardware.

They also have 192 VS instructions and 128 constants in the NV2A vs the 128/96 in the GF3.

As near as I can tell, they have the same register combiner unit. 4 pipe, 4 texture, 8(or 9 depending on how you look at them) combiners.

Don't let the number of VS instructions fool you either, most of the shaders I see are only 60-70 instructions long. There shouldn't be too much difficulty porting those.

The problem would come from the combiner->DX8 Pixel Shaders.

A single combiner is "A*B + C * D", or it can do a dot product. (a,b,c,d can be anything, from a texture to a temporary)

DX8 has ADD, SUB, MUL, MAD, LRP, MOV, DP3, not quite as flexible as the register combiners, but DX8 has to be more generic to support more hardware.

If someone maxed out all 8 combiners, there may not be a way to translate it to DX8. Or the DX8 code, if the driver doesn't optimize things, might be a bit slower.

On the other hand, it's difficult (IMHO) to use up all 8 instructions right now in DX8, unless its a very very special effect. And 8 instructions would run really slow anyway. It's at *least* 8 cycles for each 4 pixels on the screen, and that doesn't include texture fetching and stuff like that.

I wouldn't fret too much, we were all blown away with the fantastic art and effects back when this was a PC/Mac product on a Rage 128, and it was only a 2-texture DX6 part. Alot of what I saw in Halo when I played it is doable on alot of older cards in 1 or 2 passes. The thing I marvel at with Halo is more in their art style, which is leaps and bounds beyond most PC/Mac gaming art.
Fortunately, art is easy to port. :)

Message Index



Replies:

Xboxes vid cardRiley 9/27/01 7:33 p.m.
     Re: Xboxes vid cardfatboy18 9/27/01 10:07 p.m.
           Re: Xboxes vid cardHethal 9/27/01 10:47 p.m.
                 Re: Xboxes vid cardFerrex (Microserf) 9/28/01 12:35 p.m.
                       Re: Xboxes vid cardDeAdLy_cOoKiE 9/28/01 1:00 p.m.
                             Re: Xboxes vid cardfatboy18 9/28/01 1:10 p.m.
                                   Re: huh?Hethal 9/28/01 6:17 p.m.
                                   Re: Xboxes vid cardvector40 9/28/01 7:58 p.m.
                       Re: Xboxes vid cardWereTiger 9/28/01 1:04 p.m.
                             Re: Xboxes vid cardvector40 9/28/01 7:58 p.m.
                       Louis...Ferrex (Microserf) 9/28/01 2:31 p.m.
                             Re: Louis...fate 9/28/01 2:37 p.m.
                             Re: Louis...Louis Wu 9/28/01 3:01 p.m.
                       Re: Xboxes vid cardMercilessKK 9/28/01 5:13 p.m.
                             Re: Xboxes vid cardHethal 9/28/01 6:21 p.m.
                                   Re: Xboxes vid cardvector40 9/28/01 8:00 p.m.
                             Re: Xboxes vid cardvector40 9/28/01 8:00 p.m.
                       Re: Xboxes vid cardsnatcheroo 9/29/01 2:48 a.m.
           Re: Xboxes vid cardfoo 9/27/01 11:27 p.m.
                 Re: Xboxes vid cardMax Payne 9/27/01 11:59 p.m.
                       Re: Xboxes vid cardvector40 9/28/01 12:23 a.m.
                             Re: Xboxes vid cardCunbelin The Surly 9/28/01 2:57 a.m.
                                   Re: Xboxes vid cardDeAdLy_cOoKiE 9/28/01 2:03 p.m.
                                         Re: Xboxes vid cardCunbelin The Windbag 9/28/01 3:25 p.m.
                                   Re: Xboxes vid cardvector40 9/28/01 7:53 p.m.
                 Re: Xboxes vid cardvector40 9/28/01 12:22 a.m.
                       Re: Xboxes vid cardSaber 9/28/01 6:01 a.m.
                             Faster core (233Mhz), slower memory (200DDR). *NM*Djof 9/28/01 8:20 a.m.
                                   Re: Faster core (233Mhz), slower memory (200DDR).? 9/28/01 10:29 a.m.
                                         Re: Faster core (233Mhz), slower memory (200DDR).bullseye 9/28/01 11:37 a.m.
                                               Re: Faster core (233Mhz), slower memory (200DDR).vector40 9/28/01 7:55 p.m.
                                               Re: Faster core (233Mhz), slower memory (200DDR).Dan Rudolph 9/29/01 12:49 a.m.
                                   Rumor has it at 210MHz nowKanen Faud'r 9/28/01 11:43 a.m.
           Re: Xboxes vid cardLophan 9/28/01 7:23 a.m.
                 Re: Xboxes vid card/lets not be sillyapache02 9/28/01 1:39 p.m.
                       Re: Xboxes vid card/lets not be sillyJohnny Rotten 9/28/01 4:54 p.m.
     Re: Xboxes vid cardTimothy Wilson 9/28/01 5:53 p.m.



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