Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds


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Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds

Posted By: Yossarian Date: 3/8/04 7:16 a.m.
In Response To: Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds (Steve Levinson)

: The whole concept of the Pfhor and AI's is an interesting one and open to a
: lot of speculation. Clearly at the time of the attack on the Marathon they
: essentially had no AI technology of their own. In effect, they used the
: enslaved S'pht as their AI's.
Also, who knows how much "processing power" the cyborg pfhor master controller:
"The S'pht and myself have come to an understanding. They are
controlled through their mechanical exoskeleton by a cyborg
Pfhor onboard the Alien ship. This mutant Pfhor is able to
direct the actions of thousands of S'pht simultaneously.
If you can kill their master, they will revolt."
Maybe that dude doubled as an AI? We know from M2/MI that their ships had a command structure, so maybe a lot of the processing load could have been handled by the cyborg pfhor.
Once the S'pht discovered Durandal and Tycho
: on the Marathon, however, they became very interested in AI technology and
: they adopted and cloned Tycho extensively. Now we've been lead to believe
: that Durandal, Tycho and Lela were all based on acquired Jjaro technology
: and, hence, they share a common element with Thoth, but they clearly have
: more human personalities as compared to Thoth's very Jjaro-like
: personality.
I'm not so sure about that Steve, IIRC that is the correct line of thinking from the Rubiverse, but I don't know how solid the proof is that Jjarotech made it into Traxus. We do learn, however, that the marine himself was most likely the recipient of Jjarotech implants, though maybe not the sole recipient. You're right about the fact that there's a lot to speculate about.
In that sense, Tycho was more useful to them, but I still
: tend to think that the S'pht either never told the Pfhor about Thoth, even
: though they knew of his existence, or the Pfhor didn't recognize his
: importance. The S'pht interacted with and helped Durandal, who was already
: rapant, but they turned Tycho over to the Pfhor and helped them to induce
: his own rapancy. Why?
Possibly because they understood the implications of choosing one over the other. They understood or soon determined that it was Durandal who summoned not only the Pfhor but all the aliens, and when it became apparent that Durandal was going to be a powerful ally, and that Tycho was a ticking time bomb about to explode with rampancy, they made the correct choice and loaded Tycho onto the pfhor as fast as they could.
The S'Pht know a good AI when they see one, they'd worked on their own and then worked as the Pfhor's, so there may have been things they saw in either that allowed them to further support their decision.
But I think that the Pfhor, being the
: Pfhor, would have destroyed Thoth rather than leave him to rot on Lh'owon.
Yeah, but again, that's if they knew about him. And if they did, there's evidence they didn't care:
"Thoth is now trying to aid the
Pfhor, but they are obstinate and continue
to ignore him."
Francis' Hyperthesis:
The Pfhor need only raw processing power from an AI, not a personality. As long as the "dumb" computers could take care of navigation, weapons controls, and things such as that, there was no purpose in the AI having a personality. he commanders could make the decisions, the computers could plot courses, and the directives would come from the bureaucracy. Consider: would an AI with a personality such as Durandal, Tycho, Leela, or even Thoth be able to operate effectively within the Pfhor bureuacracy's stiff parameters? Tycho couldn't; he stood out like a sore thumb. He hijacked their terminals and ran from place to place. The Pfhor probably didn't understand him personality-wise, and certainly couldn't control that asoect either. While Tycho was useful to the Pfhor to a point (knowledge of science, engineering, and humanity in general) he could control their networks and take over their ships, killing the commanders with only a little help from the player.
Because the Pfhor only needed real processing power, they probably didn't see much inherent value in Thoth if they knew about him, and I doubt they did because the bugs *did* take the AI's they had access to. Durandal was out of their reach, so they took Tycho and Leela (who was later stolen from them).
Humans, being beasts of communication, wanted a liason between themselves and the systems that ran their technology, this being the personality of the AI. Such a setup would have been most advantageous considering 100% of a human crew would need or want to interact with one or multiple ship-board AI's on a regular basis. The Pfhor, however, are essentially mindless bugs with no knoweldge or reason to access an AI (with the exception of the smaller percent of higher castes on board); after all, that's what the S'Pht are for. So essentially, the compilers take the place of an AI's personality in the Pfhor techonological structure.
When the S'Pht came across Durandal, they found a construct that could easily perform their function and wanted to help them free themselves. Instead of standing at terminals all day they could plot their revolution and scheme tactics with their new best friend. Sort of like when our ancestors took up agriculture, dig what I'm saying?
I can't even remember what this post was supposed to be about, but yeah, that's my two cents...
Yossarian

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: Also, who knows how much "processing power" the cyborg pfhor master : controller: "The S'pht and myself have come to an understanding. They : are : controlled through their mechanical exoskeleton by a cyborg : Pfhor onboard the Alien ship. This mutant Pfhor is able to : direct the actions of thousands of S'pht simultaneously. : If you can kill their master, they will revolt." : Maybe that dude doubled as an AI? We know from M2/MI that their ships had a : command structure, so maybe a lot of the processing load could have been : handled by the cyborg pfhor. : Once the S'pht discovered Durandal and Tycho : I'm not so sure about that Steve, IIRC that is the correct line of thinking : from the Rubiverse, but I don't know how solid the proof is that Jjarotech : made it into Traxus. We do learn, however, that the marine himself was : most likely the recipient of Jjarotech implants, though maybe not the sole : recipient. You're right about the fact that there's a lot to speculate : about. : In that sense, Tycho was more useful to them, but I still : Possibly because they understood the implications of choosing one over the : other. They understood or soon determined that it was Durandal who : summoned not only the Pfhor but all the aliens, and when it became : apparent that Durandal was going to be a powerful ally, and that Tycho was : a ticking time bomb about to explode with rampancy, they made the correct : choice and loaded Tycho onto the pfhor as fast as they could. : The S'Pht know a good AI when they see one, they'd worked on their own and : then worked as the Pfhor's, so there may have been things they saw in : either that allowed them to further support their decision. : But I think that the Pfhor, being the : Yeah, but again, that's if they knew about him. And if they did, there's : evidence they didn't care: "Thoth is now trying to aid the : Pfhor, but they are obstinate and continue : to ignore him." : Francis' Hyperthesis: The Pfhor need only raw processing power from an AI, : not a personality. As long as the "dumb" computers could take : care of navigation, weapons controls, and things such as that, there was : no purpose in the AI having a personality. he commanders could make the : decisions, the computers could plot courses, and the directives would come : from the bureaucracy. Consider: would an AI with a personality such as : Durandal, Tycho, Leela, or even Thoth be able to operate effectively : within the Pfhor bureuacracy's stiff parameters? Tycho couldn't; he stood : out like a sore thumb. He hijacked their terminals and ran from place to : place. The Pfhor probably didn't understand him personality-wise, and : certainly couldn't control that asoect either. While Tycho was useful to : the Pfhor to a point (knowledge of science, engineering, and humanity in : general) he could control their networks and take over their ships, : killing the commanders with only a little help from the player. : Because the Pfhor only needed real processing power, they probably didn't see : much inherent value in Thoth if they knew about him, and I doubt they did : because the bugs *did* take the AI's they had access to. Durandal was out : of their reach, so they took Tycho and Leela (who was later stolen from : them). : Humans, being beasts of communication, wanted a liason between themselves and : the systems that ran their technology, this being the personality of the : AI. Such a setup would have been most advantageous considering 100% of a : human crew would need or want to interact with one or multiple ship-board : AI's on a regular basis. The Pfhor, however, are essentially mindless bugs : with no knoweldge or reason to access an AI (with the exception of the : smaller percent of higher castes on board); after all, that's what the : S'Pht are for. So essentially, the compilers take the place of an AI's : personality in the Pfhor techonological structure. : When the S'Pht came across Durandal, they found a construct that could easily : perform their function and wanted to help them free themselves. Instead of : standing at terminals all day they could plot their revolution and scheme : tactics with their new best friend. Sort of like when our ancestors took : up agriculture, dig what I'm saying? : I can't even remember what this post was supposed to be about, but yeah, : that's my two cents... : Yossarian

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EV: Marathon	Kirk	3/7/04 2:53 a.m.
Re: EV: Marathon	Elliott	3/7/04 2:03 p.m.
Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Steve Levinson	3/7/04 7:05 p.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Elliott	3/7/04 10:19 p.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	D-M.A.	3/7/04 11:32 p.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Steve Levinson	3/8/04 4:34 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	D-M.A.	3/8/04 6:06 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	D-M.A.	3/8/04 6:13 a.m.
iiiiiiiick!!! It happened again!!!!! NM	D-M.A.	3/8/04 6:14 a.m.
Thats it, im never posting from this pc again! :((	D-M.A.	3/8/04 6:19 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Steve Levinson	3/8/04 7:02 a.m.
wash yer keyboard before ya come back! NM	Yossarian	3/8/04 7:26 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Steve Levinson	3/8/04 7:13 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Yossarian	3/8/04 7:23 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	D-M.A.	3/8/04 7:28 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Adam Ashwell	3/8/04 10:33 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Yossarian	3/8/04 11:46 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Yossarian	3/8/04 7:16 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	D-M.A.	3/8/04 7:47 a.m.
Re: Pfhor occupation of enslaved worlds	Steve Levinson	3/8/04 8:16 a.m.
Re: EV: Marathon	Kirk	3/8/04 1:17 a.m.
Re: EV: Marathon	Elliott	3/8/04 6:56 a.m.
Re: EV: Marathon	Ozymandias	3/7/04 3:01 p.m.
Re: EV: Marathon	Kirk	3/8/04 12:58 a.m.
Say, have you been to the ambrosiasw.com forums? NM	CATS	3/8/04 6:02 p.m.
Re: Say, have you been to the ambrosiasw.com forum	Kirk	3/9/04 1:02 a.m.
Re: Say, have you been to the ambrosiasw.com forum	CATS	3/11/04 6:03 p.m.
Re: Say, have you been to the ambrosiasw.com forum	Kirk	3/12/04 12:47 a.m.



	Your Name:
	Your E-Mail Address:
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	Message: : Also, who knows how much "processing power" the cyborg pfhor master : controller: "The S'pht and myself have come to an understanding. They : are : controlled through their mechanical exoskeleton by a cyborg : Pfhor onboard the Alien ship. This mutant Pfhor is able to : direct the actions of thousands of S'pht simultaneously. : If you can kill their master, they will revolt." : Maybe that dude doubled as an AI? We know from M2/MI that their ships had a : command structure, so maybe a lot of the processing load could have been : handled by the cyborg pfhor. : Once the S'pht discovered Durandal and Tycho : I'm not so sure about that Steve, IIRC that is the correct line of thinking : from the Rubiverse, but I don't know how solid the proof is that Jjarotech : made it into Traxus. We do learn, however, that the marine himself was : most likely the recipient of Jjarotech implants, though maybe not the sole : recipient. You're right about the fact that there's a lot to speculate : about. : In that sense, Tycho was more useful to them, but I still : Possibly because they understood the implications of choosing one over the : other. They understood or soon determined that it was Durandal who : summoned not only the Pfhor but all the aliens, and when it became : apparent that Durandal was going to be a powerful ally, and that Tycho was : a ticking time bomb about to explode with rampancy, they made the correct : choice and loaded Tycho onto the pfhor as fast as they could. : The S'Pht know a good AI when they see one, they'd worked on their own and : then worked as the Pfhor's, so there may have been things they saw in : either that allowed them to further support their decision. : But I think that the Pfhor, being the : Yeah, but again, that's if they knew about him. And if they did, there's : evidence they didn't care: "Thoth is now trying to aid the : Pfhor, but they are obstinate and continue : to ignore him." : Francis' Hyperthesis: The Pfhor need only raw processing power from an AI, : not a personality. As long as the "dumb" computers could take : care of navigation, weapons controls, and things such as that, there was : no purpose in the AI having a personality. he commanders could make the : decisions, the computers could plot courses, and the directives would come : from the bureaucracy. Consider: would an AI with a personality such as : Durandal, Tycho, Leela, or even Thoth be able to operate effectively : within the Pfhor bureuacracy's stiff parameters? Tycho couldn't; he stood : out like a sore thumb. He hijacked their terminals and ran from place to : place. The Pfhor probably didn't understand him personality-wise, and : certainly couldn't control that asoect either. While Tycho was useful to : the Pfhor to a point (knowledge of science, engineering, and humanity in : general) he could control their networks and take over their ships, : killing the commanders with only a little help from the player. : Because the Pfhor only needed real processing power, they probably didn't see : much inherent value in Thoth if they knew about him, and I doubt they did : because the bugs did take the AI's they had access to. Durandal was out : of their reach, so they took Tycho and Leela (who was later stolen from : them). : Humans, being beasts of communication, wanted a liason between themselves and : the systems that ran their technology, this being the personality of the : AI. Such a setup would have been most advantageous considering 100% of a : human crew would need or want to interact with one or multiple ship-board : AI's on a regular basis. The Pfhor, however, are essentially mindless bugs : with no knoweldge or reason to access an AI (with the exception of the : smaller percent of higher castes on board); after all, that's what the : S'Pht are for. So essentially, the compilers take the place of an AI's : personality in the Pfhor techonological structure. : When the S'Pht came across Durandal, they found a construct that could easily : perform their function and wanted to help them free themselves. Instead of : standing at terminals all day they could plot their revolution and scheme : tactics with their new best friend. Sort of like when our ancestors took : up agriculture, dig what I'm saying? : I can't even remember what this post was supposed to be about, but yeah, : that's my two cents... : Yossarian
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