Re: The hindmost creche


	/-/S'pht-Translator-Active/-/

Re: The hindmost creche

Posted By: Aaron Freed Date: 9/23/21 10:52 a.m.
In Response To: Re: The hindmost creche (VikingBoyBilly)

: Could a "dried creche" be a hatched pfhor egg?
I doubt it. The context is Tfear discussing how he’s the only survivor on the ship (getting some The Rime of the Ancient Mariner vibes from this), so as Hamish pointed out in the previous thread, it probably means a dead creche.
: Is the Great Mother the lightning goddess Boomer was originally named
: for? Somehow I doubt an unremarkable scout ship would get named for
: a figure Tfear holds in such high prominence. Maybe The Great Mother is
: a higher goddess, and the "throne" is on top of Pfhor Olympus, where
: she gives birth to lightning goddesses and high admirals.
My reading is partially along the lines of pfhore’s speculation, that she’s regarded as the mother of the whole species (the queen bee is a good comparison). However, the text is definitely written to be accessible to multiple interpretations, and the way Tfear refers to her suggests that she’s also a subject of prayer (and thus that the Pfhor regard her as a deity).
If she is a deity, the diction and structure of the “Aie Mak Sicur” terminal suggest she’s considered one of the most important in their pantheon, if not the most important outright – Tfear wouldn’t pray to a minor goddess in the final moments of his life. Their religion is apparently polytheistic (Durandal refers to Sfiera as “their goddess of lightning and passion” rather than simply “their goddess”), but I suspect she occupies a position comparable to, e.g., Odin’s in the Norse pantheon, Isis or Osiris’ in the Egyptian pantheon, or Jupiter or Apollo’s in the Roman pantheon.
Of course, Jupiter and Zeus were both thunder gods and were among the most important figures in their respective panthea (and Thor, the Norse thunder god, is hardly a minor deity himself); for that matter, Aphrodite and Venus (the Greek and Roman goddesses of love, sex, and desire) were also major figures in their respective panthea. A “goddess of lightning and passion” therefore isn’t necessarily a minor figure in their pantheon. However, I think it unlikely that they’d name a minor scout ship after a major goddess, so I suspect Sfiera is not the Great Mother.
(In many panthea, passion and motherhood are also represented by two different deities – in Greek mythology, Hera was the goddess of marriage, family, and childbirth, in contrast with Aphrodite’s role. [Hera equates to Juno in the Roman pantheon.] However, this is not always the case; for much of Egyptian history, Hathor was the goddess of both sexuality and maternal care, although she also possessed a vengeful aspect. Sometimes Hathor’s vengeful side is equated with the goddess Sekhmet [whose name can also be spelled Sakhmet, Sachmis, Scheme, etc.; people who have played Eternal may see the relevance here], and in some traditions, they are considered two aspects of the same goddess, while in others, Hathor is apparently Sekhmet’s mother. In summation, Egyptian mythology is a head trip.)
tl;dr: the Great Mother may be a major figure in the Pfhor pantheon, or may be regarded as their literal mother, or something else, or some/all of the above. My suspicion is that at least the first two are intended as valid readings, but the text is too ambiguous to be certain (perhaps intentionally, since in-universe, we aren’t the intended audience of Tfear’s message).

[ Post a Reply | Message Index | Read Prev Msg | Read Next Msg ]
Pre-2004 Posts

Replies:

The hindmost creche VikingBoyBilly 9/22/21 5:11 a.m.

Re: The hindmost creche Godot 9/22/21 5:44 a.m.

Re: The hindmost creche VikingBoyBilly 9/22/21 4:19 p.m.

Re: The hindmost creche Aaron Freed 9/22/21 8:45 p.m.

Re: The hindmost creche VikingBoyBilly 9/23/21 3:55 a.m.

Re: The hindmost creche pfhore 9/23/21 5:17 a.m.

Re: The hindmost creche VikingBoyBilly 9/23/21 8:10 a.m.

Re: The hindmost creche Aaron Freed 9/23/21 10:52 a.m.

Re: The hindmost creche Tim "Mordeir" Branin 9/23/21 3:01 p.m.

Re: The hindmost creche Aaron Freed 9/25/21 11:51 a.m.

[ Post a Reply | Message Index | Read Prev Msg | Read Next Msg ]
Pre-2004 Posts

Your Name:
Your E-Mail Address:
Subject:
Message:
: I doubt it. The context is Tfear discussing how he’s the only survivor on the : ship (getting some The Rime of the Ancient Mariner vibes from this), so : as Hamish pointed out in the previous thread, it probably means a dead : creche. : My reading is partially along the lines of pfhore’s speculation, that she’s : regarded as the mother of the whole species (the queen bee is a good : comparison). However, the text is definitely written to be accessible to : multiple interpretations, and the way Tfear refers to her suggests that : she’s also a subject of prayer (and thus that the Pfhor regard her as a : deity). : If she is a deity, the diction and structure of the “Aie Mak Sicur” terminal : suggest she’s considered one of the most important in their pantheon, if : not the most important outright – Tfear wouldn’t pray to a minor goddess : in the final moments of his life. Their religion is apparently : polytheistic (Durandal refers to Sfiera as “their goddess of lightning and : passion” rather than simply “their goddess”), but I suspect she occupies a : position comparable to, e.g., Odin’s in the Norse pantheon, Isis or : Osiris’ in the Egyptian pantheon, or Jupiter or Apollo’s in the Roman : pantheon. : Of course, Jupiter and Zeus were both thunder gods and were among the most : important figures in their respective panthea (and Thor, the Norse thunder : god, is hardly a minor deity himself); for that matter, Aphrodite and : Venus (the Greek and Roman goddesses of love, sex, and desire) were also : major figures in their respective panthea. A “goddess of lightning and : passion” therefore isn’t necessarily a minor figure in their pantheon. : However, I think it unlikely that they’d name a minor scout ship after a : major goddess, so I suspect Sfiera is not the Great Mother. : (In many panthea, passion and motherhood are also represented by two : different deities – in Greek mythology, Hera was the goddess of marriage, : family, and childbirth, in contrast with Aphrodite’s role. [Hera equates : to Juno in the Roman pantheon.] However, this is not always the case; for : much of Egyptian history, Hathor was the goddess of both sexuality and : maternal care, although she also possessed a vengeful aspect. Sometimes : Hathor’s vengeful side is equated with the goddess Sekhmet [whose name can : also be spelled Sakhmet, Sachmis, Scheme, etc.; people who have played : Eternal may see the relevance here], and in some traditions, they are : considered two aspects of the same goddess, while in others, Hathor is : apparently Sekhmet’s mother. In summation, Egyptian mythology is a head : trip.) : tl;dr: the Great Mother may be a major figure in the Pfhor pantheon, or may : be regarded as their literal mother, or something else, or some/all of the : above. My suspicion is that at least the first two are intended as valid : readings, but the text is too ambiguous to be certain (perhaps : intentionally, since in-universe, we aren’t the intended audience of : Tfear’s message).

If you'd like to include a link to another page with your message,
please provide both the URL address and the title of the page:
Optional Link URL:
Optional Link Title:

If necessary, enter your password below:
Password:

Problems? Suggestions? Comments? Email maintainer@bungie.org
Marathon's Story Forum is maintained with WebBBS 5.12.

The hindmost creche	VikingBoyBilly	9/22/21 5:11 a.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	Godot	9/22/21 5:44 a.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	VikingBoyBilly	9/22/21 4:19 p.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	Aaron Freed	9/22/21 8:45 p.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	VikingBoyBilly	9/23/21 3:55 a.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	pfhore	9/23/21 5:17 a.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	VikingBoyBilly	9/23/21 8:10 a.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	Aaron Freed	9/23/21 10:52 a.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	Tim "Mordeir" Branin	9/23/21 3:01 p.m.
Re: The hindmost creche	Aaron Freed	9/25/21 11:51 a.m.



	Your Name:
	Your E-Mail Address:
	Subject:
	Message: : I doubt it. The context is Tfear discussing how he’s the only survivor on the : ship (getting some The Rime of the Ancient Mariner vibes from this), so : as Hamish pointed out in the previous thread, it probably means a dead : creche. : My reading is partially along the lines of pfhore’s speculation, that she’s : regarded as the mother of the whole species (the queen bee is a good : comparison). However, the text is definitely written to be accessible to : multiple interpretations, and the way Tfear refers to her suggests that : she’s also a subject of prayer (and thus that the Pfhor regard her as a : deity). : If she is a deity, the diction and structure of the “Aie Mak Sicur” terminal : suggest she’s considered one of the most important in their pantheon, if : not the most important outright – Tfear wouldn’t pray to a minor goddess : in the final moments of his life. Their religion is apparently : polytheistic (Durandal refers to Sfiera as “their goddess of lightning and : passion” rather than simply “their goddess”), but I suspect she occupies a : position comparable to, e.g., Odin’s in the Norse pantheon, Isis or : Osiris’ in the Egyptian pantheon, or Jupiter or Apollo’s in the Roman : pantheon. : Of course, Jupiter and Zeus were both thunder gods and were among the most : important figures in their respective panthea (and Thor, the Norse thunder : god, is hardly a minor deity himself); for that matter, Aphrodite and : Venus (the Greek and Roman goddesses of love, sex, and desire) were also : major figures in their respective panthea. A “goddess of lightning and : passion” therefore isn’t necessarily a minor figure in their pantheon. : However, I think it unlikely that they’d name a minor scout ship after a : major goddess, so I suspect Sfiera is not the Great Mother. : (In many panthea, passion and motherhood are also represented by two : different deities – in Greek mythology, Hera was the goddess of marriage, : family, and childbirth, in contrast with Aphrodite’s role. [Hera equates : to Juno in the Roman pantheon.] However, this is not always the case; for : much of Egyptian history, Hathor was the goddess of both sexuality and : maternal care, although she also possessed a vengeful aspect. Sometimes : Hathor’s vengeful side is equated with the goddess Sekhmet [whose name can : also be spelled Sakhmet, Sachmis, Scheme, etc.; people who have played : Eternal may see the relevance here], and in some traditions, they are : considered two aspects of the same goddess, while in others, Hathor is : apparently Sekhmet’s mother. In summation, Egyptian mythology is a head : trip.) : tl;dr: the Great Mother may be a major figure in the Pfhor pantheon, or may : be regarded as their literal mother, or something else, or some/all of the : above. My suspicion is that at least the first two are intended as valid : readings, but the text is too ambiguous to be certain (perhaps : intentionally, since in-universe, we aren’t the intended audience of : Tfear’s message).
	If you'd like to include a link to another page with your message, please provide both the URL address and the title of the page:
	Optional Link URL:
	Optional Link Title:
	If necessary, enter your password below:
	Password: