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OK. I Think I'm On To Something (was: Beta 3 Test)
Posted By: AntarcticoDate: 8/18/13 6:33 p.m.

In Response To: Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3) (Hopper)

: Yeah, that's right. Glue triggers wake up everyone until the signal hits
: superglue, just like M2 triggers and zone borders. I don't know if there's
: a limit to the trigger's range...

I had an inspiration about a better way to test the theory that it is the higher engine limits in Aleph One that might be contributing to the puzzling behavior we have been experiencing in Pfhoraphobia. I decided to try testing with Hopper's Classic Limits plugin installed. His plugin, as you might recall, restores the original Marathon engine limits to Aleph One. When I play tested with the plugin enabled, I got some interesting results. Please note, for this session of testing, I was not pre-triggering the first monster closet, I was triggering both traps at the trigger ploy like the map makers intended. Here is some of what I observed:

-- One run through where, as I was running back to the first closet, I saw at least one of the enforcers frozen and warbling as I had activated more monsters than the original Marathon limits could handle. This means, almost certainly, the throne room Enforcers had detected me and activated the other throne room monsters and this combined total exceeded the classic engine limit.

-- Another run through where, after I ran back and cleared out the first closet, having to run past it to take out a few following critters, I noticed an unexpected lull in the action, and when I stuck my head around the corner I saw a clot of projectile and staff Fighters, Enforcers, and Compilers, all just kind of chillin' in front of the second closet like they forgotten I was there. When they caught sight of me, they reactivated and came after me.

-- On yet another run, both closets activated me and pursued me including a couple cloaked compilers. When I cleared out all this, I went back to the throne room to blast the Pfhor controller, and after I got off my shot, more Compilers rose up into the corridor. Clearly some, but not all of the Compilers activated when I sprung the closet trap, or some of those that activated got sleepy from too many active monsters and did not initially fly up to pursue me.

-- Also I noticed active monsters were not pursuing me across as many polygons as before, not surprising as this path limit is reset to the original Marathon's limit of 20 (paths value="20"). I noticed this in the hidden winding path area behind the starting point secret door -- Pfhor would lose track of me on the curved staircase unless I paused a few times to allow them to catch up and keep me in sight. I think this might also explain, in part, why some of the activated trap Pfhor and Compilers seemed to forget I was around.

Overall, with Hopper's Classic Limits plugin, the trap area clearly and consistently played differently than without it. Also, there were some minor but noticeable differences in how well activated Pfhor could keep track of me once I was out of sight. I think, based on my observation, all beta testing that is concerned with monster behavior, betas vs. original Marathon, be done with Hopper's plugin installed and enabled. I believe many of the "AI" related issues we have collectively been experiencing are directly related to Aleph One's higher engine limits.

I am going to call this particular mystery potentially solved. :)

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Pre-2004 Posts

Replies:

Aleph One 1.1b3treellama 8/13/13 5:31 p.m.
     Re: Aleph One 1.1b3poena.dare 8/13/13 5:40 p.m.
     Re: Aleph One 1.1b3PerseusSpartacus 8/13/13 7:36 p.m.
           Re: Aleph One 1.1b3treellama 8/14/13 4:22 a.m.
                 Re: Aleph One 1.1b3PerseusSpartacus 8/14/13 8:26 a.m.
     Re: Aleph One 1.1b3Antarctico 8/13/13 11:50 p.m.
           Re: Aleph One 1.1b3Godot 8/14/13 4:44 a.m.
                 Re: Aleph One 1.1b3Antarctico 8/14/13 6:09 a.m.
     Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/14/13 12:57 a.m.
           Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/14/13 1:38 a.m.
                 Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)treellama 8/14/13 3:41 a.m.
                       Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/14/13 4:32 a.m.
                       Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/14/13 4:41 a.m.
           Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/14/13 4:04 a.m.
                 Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/14/13 12:24 p.m.
                       Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/14/13 2:37 p.m.
                             Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/14/13 11:13 p.m.
                                   Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/16/13 5:48 p.m.
                                         Memory Is A Funny Thing (was: Beta 3 Testing...)Antarctico 8/16/13 6:24 p.m.
                                         Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/16/13 10:32 p.m.
                       Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Hopper 8/16/13 7:14 a.m.
                             Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)PerseusSpartacus 8/16/13 7:20 a.m.
                             Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/16/13 7:44 a.m.
                       Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Hopper 8/17/13 9:52 a.m.
                             Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/17/13 10:43 a.m.
                                   Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/17/13 10:55 a.m.
                                         Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)treellama 8/17/13 11:12 a.m.
                                         Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Hopper 8/17/13 11:37 a.m.
                                               Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/17/13 12:08 p.m.
                                                     Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Dr. John Sumner 8/18/13 2:41 a.m.
                                                           Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/18/13 3:04 a.m.
                                                                 Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Dr. John Sumner 8/18/13 3:19 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Godot 8/18/13 3:41 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Dr. John Sumner 8/18/13 4:09 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Hopper 8/18/13 8:01 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Dr. John Sumner 8/18/13 8:33 a.m.
                                                                                         OK. I Think I'm On To Something (was: Beta 3 Test)Antarctico 8/18/13 6:33 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: OK. I Think I'm On To Something (was: Beta 3 THopper 8/18/13 9:27 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: OK. I Think I'm On To Something (was: Beta 3 TAntarctico 8/19/13 12:57 a.m.
                                                                 Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/18/13 6:35 p.m.
                                                     Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/18/13 8:27 a.m.
                                         Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/17/13 1:22 p.m.
                             Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)Antarctico 8/18/13 8:56 a.m.
           Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)PerseusSpartacus 8/14/13 12:08 p.m.
                 Re: Beta 3 Testing (was: Aleph One 1.1b3)PerseusSpartacus 8/15/13 1:52 p.m.
     Re: Aleph One 1.1b3Godot 8/14/13 4:03 a.m.
           Re: Aleph One 1.1b3poena.dare 8/14/13 5:01 a.m.
                 Re: Aleph One 1.1b3Antarctico 8/14/13 6:10 a.m.
                 Re: Aleph One 1.1b3Godot 8/14/13 9:05 a.m.
     Re: Aleph One 1.1b3Godot 8/14/13 7:22 a.m.
     One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Antarctico 8/14/13 9:18 p.m.
           Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)treellama 8/15/13 4:22 a.m.
                 Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Godot 8/15/13 4:53 a.m.
                       Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Dr. John Sumner 8/15/13 5:29 a.m.
                             Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Godot 8/15/13 5:52 a.m.
                                   Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)treellama 8/15/13 6:08 a.m.
                                         Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Godot 8/15/13 6:27 a.m.
                                               Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)treellama 8/15/13 6:45 a.m.
                                                     Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Godot 8/15/13 7:13 a.m.
                                                           Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)PerseusSpartacus 8/15/13 7:23 a.m.
                                                           Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Hopper 8/16/13 11:03 a.m.
                                                           Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Antarctico 8/16/13 2:29 p.m.
                                                                 Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Godot 8/16/13 11:04 p.m.
                                                                       Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Godot 8/16/13 11:15 p.m.
                                                                             Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)treellama 8/17/13 10:57 a.m.
                             Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)treellama 8/15/13 5:56 a.m.
                                   Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Dr. John Sumner 8/15/13 6:27 a.m.
                                         Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Godot 8/15/13 6:35 a.m.
                                         Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Antarctico 8/16/13 2:48 p.m.
                             Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Dispatcher 8/15/13 6:54 a.m.
                 Re: One Man's Canon Is Another's PITA (long)Antarctico 8/16/13 2:12 p.m.

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