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	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited
	Posted By: Max Etchemendy	Date: 2/5/02 9:13 p.m.
	In Response To: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited (Beer Can) Hey all, While it's true that Bungie was clearly influenced by a lot of different sources, virtually all creative artists are. The Tolkien example is a good one...basically the entire genre of high fantasy is just one gigantic derivative of Lord of the Rings. Note that I say "derivative," not rip-off. I think we need to give Bungie some credit, because there's a difference between playing around with existing stereotypes and just outright lifting a plot from someone. I think my main criterion for deciding if something is a rip-off or not is whether or not it adds something new. A genuine rip-off is a thinly-veiled copy of a previous work of art that attempts to gain acceptance/success merely based on the success of the previous work. But virtually all art contains some element of influence, which is more like, "Wow, that's really cool...what if I did =this= with that theme? That would be cool, too!" An example: The Matrix had a ton of obvious influences: the idea of "brains trapped in a jar" is a classic subjectivist philosophical exercise; the term "The Matrix" is right out of William Gibson's "Neuromancer"; the fight scenes were classic Kung Fu action; the influence of the Terminator films on some of the action sequences and characters (especially the Agents) is clear...the list goes on. But The Matrix still revolutionized science fiction as a film genre, to such an extent that people even use the terms "pre-Matrix" and "post-Matrix" to describe science fiction movies. My point is that The Matrix, while heavily derivative of previous classics in both literature and cinema, was not at all a rip-off, and it did a lot for the genre and the culture as a whole. If you still don't believe that virtually every piece of art ever created is heavily derivative of previous works, try an experiment. Write a decent short story that you think is original in its themes, language, characters, etc. and then read it back to yourself. Odds are you won't be able to count the major influences on one hand. Therefore, let's give Bungie some slack, eh? :-) Sincerely, -Max P.S. Actually, just to prove the point further, anybody who thinks that J.R.R. Tolkien was Mr. Out-of-the-Blue Original should read the Anglo-Saxon epic poem Beowulf.

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Replies:

	Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	Beer Can	2/4/02 12:44 a.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	SiliconDream =PN=	2/4/02 1:29 a.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	Beer Can	2/4/02 5:26 p.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	SiliconDream =PN=	2/5/02 1:01 a.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	AJS	2/4/02 11:31 p.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	Max Etchemendy	2/5/02 9:13 p.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	Beer Can	2/6/02 1:09 a.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	Max Etchemendy	2/6/02 3:44 p.m.
	My apologies...	SiliconDream =PN=	2/6/02 5:37 p.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	Beer Can	2/6/02 9:40 p.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	SiliconDream =PN=	2/6/02 5:35 p.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	Beer Can	2/7/02 12:13 a.m.
	Re: Bungie Rip-Offs, Revisited	SiliconDream =PN=	2/7/02 1:04 a.m.
	Rabid? Ha!	poenadare	2/7/02 2:44 a.m.
	Impossible	mnemesis	2/7/02 12:47 p.m.
	Re: Impossible	M-Class	2/7/02 7:21 p.m.
	Re: Impossible	Mark Levin	2/8/02 4:02 p.m.
	Re: Impossible	mnemesis	2/9/02 10:05 a.m.

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