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Re: Mjolnir = slave
Posted By: D-M.A.Date: 9/20/02 12:45 a.m.

In Response To: Re: Mjolnir = slave (Scifiteki)

Very interesting discussion. Now, since I've managed to consume a larger amount of alcohol this last year than my body can sustain, my memory is getting a bit fragmented, but I'll try an input anyways, and then you can laugh at me later on.
I think your theory falls apart a bit in the end of M2 and Moo. In the end of M2 the player fools Thoth in a way by having an extra copy of Durandal, so he can't be his servant, right? And in the end of Infinity the player disobeys Tycho, and if I remember correctly there were no sign of Durandal then anymore, or? If so it would seem that the player was acting on his own?

: Ahem. Anyway, now that I have some actual time, I'll go into a little more
: depth on what I was trying to say, while Evil downloads away in the
: background.

: Basically, my premise was that, it's quite plausible that the player is a
: slave robot, but not in the way we would think about it, where the robot
: is acutely aware of it's enslavement, but is unable or unwilling for
: programming reasons to do anything about it.

: I think this idea has been touched on before, but perhaps the original
: creators of the Battleroids, be they the Jjaro or just human scientists,
: decided: For a device of such power and ability to think independantly,
: (After all, we are part human), the simple strictures of robot programming
: would not be enough. The cyborg must honestly believe that it's obeying of
: orders is based on loyalty, honour and desire to do good. That's not to sa
: that it's orders would be as such, but it must appear that, from the
: cyborg's point of view, he has "free will", he just chooses not
: to excercise it for one reason or another.

: Additional safeguards could be built in. You wouldn't want your cyborg
: wandering all around the place, righting unrelated wrongs and so forth and
: ignoring the mission. However, you wouldn't want him to realise that he's
: not allowed to do so. The solution? Make it so that the commander of the
: cyborg can define a certain area in which it is suppose to operate, and
: program it so that the cyborg is physically incapable of even *seeing*
: anything resembling ways out of an area. Of course, you might say that
: that would be pretty hard to program, but it would not be impossible, and
: programming has already advanced enough so that AIs consisting of millions
: of exobytes can be coded, so it would be a realtively simple task.
: (Hehehe. I like that, it's a wonderful cop-out to explain the limitedness
: of maps)

: Interestingly, though Durandal seeks, on just about every occasion, to test
: the limits of our strictures, teasing us about our killing abilities and
: devotion to the concepts of loyalty. Perhaps he knew all along that, no
: matter what he did, the marine would never leave him. He just physically
: would be unable.

: And the question is, does the player ever really escape from the bondage of
: one master or the other? In the end, he becomes a hero, Destiny, but is
: that synomous with freedom? I don't think so. The Jjaro, after all, are
: the *Masters* of Destiny, fate and time. With the Jjaro, you are no longer
: Durandal's Hammer, but instead you are, literally, the Hammer of Destiny,
: striking out to correct the flaws of the universe and contain that which
: might upset the balance (The Unspellable Ones).

: Of course, you could always go out on the *really* scary limb and say that
: our perspective of the world isn't the marine's, or rather, that there is
: no 'perspective of the world that is the marine's', because the entity we
: know as the marine doesn't really exist, it never had. All we are is a
: sort of extension of the AI's reach, and we, the people pressing the
: buttons, are nothing but....

: The AI's, or the Jjaro themselves.

: This might explain the "Durandal seeing the alien ship through our
: eyes" conundrum. It might explain the illusion of freedom in
: Infinity... We are no longer the extension of the AI's wrath, but the
: Jjaro's control, and the AI's only beileve they are still pressing the
: buttons. We dance between them, thinking ourselves free of the AI, when in
: fact we are just dancing to a different, greater beat.

: But that's just another theory.

: Are you free? : )

: Service With A Smile: ),
: Scifiteki

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Pre-2004 Posts

Replies:

Mjolnir = sentient robotAgent Shem 9/15/02 9:14 a.m.
     Re: Mjolnir = sentient robotarchon 9/15/02 3:29 p.m.
           Re: Mjolnir = sentient robotarchon 9/18/02 4:08 a.m.
                 Re: Mjolnir = slaveAgent Shem 9/18/02 6:18 p.m.
                       Re: Mjolnir = slaveScifiteki 9/18/02 9:23 p.m.
                             Re: Mjolnir = slaveBoomer 9/19/02 12:26 a.m.
                             Re: Mjolnir = slaveScifiteki 9/19/02 12:49 a.m.
                                   Re: Mjolnir = slaveAgent Shem 9/19/02 6:44 p.m.
                                   Re: Mjolnir = slaveD-M.A. 9/20/02 12:45 a.m.
                                         Re: Mjolnir = slavedarakat 9/21/02 12:39 a.m.
                                               Re: Mjolnir = slaveD-M.A. 9/21/02 3:39 a.m.
                                               Re: Mjolnir = slaveAgent Shem 9/21/02 8:35 a.m.
     Re: Mjolnir = sentient robotScifiteki 9/15/02 4:51 p.m.
           Re: Mjolnir = sentient robotJoyeuse 9/16/02 5:06 p.m.
     Ooooh I live in Sweden, I'm so cool *NM*Vid Boi @ Linux @ School 9/16/02 2:01 a.m.
           Thanks for that enlightening little piece, Boi.: ) *NM*Scifiteki 9/16/02 4:28 a.m.
           Yeah! We swedes rule! Let's drink some mead! *NM*Boomer 9/16/02 7:22 a.m.
                 Sweden owns!!!! *NM*goran 9/16/02 8:17 a.m.



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