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more on plot
Posted By: MrHenDate: 11/16/06 5:07 a.m.

In Response To: Re: time travel and plots in general (Forrest of B.org)

: Time travel really only creates a few kinds of plot holes, depending on how
: you do it:

I was thinking more along the lines of people messing up the plot while trying to use time-travel. People seem to enjoy "using" time-travel as a cop-out to get things done the way they want it. Plot-holes arise all over the place because the people writing whatever it is do not actually come up with a method of time-travel or handling the ensuing paradoxes.

Primer was great because it explored the fringes of those paradoxes and created an actual plot with their method of time-travel.

: (1) There is a single immutable timeline which you can change.
: Problem: paradoxes, which as self-contradictions cannot exist.

Most of these paradoxes can be solved with a few assumptions. Of course, we do not have to debate them here...

Primer used this setup. A lot of people try to use this setup, but they generally end up at option (2). If I remember correctly, The Time Machine also uses this setup.

: Sloppy solution: By some unknown mechanism, causing a paradox will gradually
: destroy the universe if you don't set things right again before it all
: goes kaboom or people start disappearing from photos.

Ah, good ol' Back to the Future. :)

: (2) There is a single immutable timeline which you cannot change.
: Problem: you shouldn't be able to travel time in the first place.

The Time Machine uses a touch of this by making certain events unchangeable (I have not read the entire book yet, it is on my to do list).

The Dune Chronicles touch on this. In the second and third books (I have not read any others yet) there is no specific time-travel, but characters can "see" into the future and can alter the future based on their choices. Since there is no actual time-travel, however, it really does not count. :P

: Sloppy solution: For some unknown reason there exists a loop in time, where
: history as you know it already involves future you having gone into the
: past, and thus all events in the plot are predestined.

Star Trek loves time-loops, and I cannot stand them, so bleh. That one Harry Potter movie also used time-loops.

: (3) Time is multilinear, where going back just creates yet another parallel
: timeline.
: Problem: No motivation to care about whether anyone changes the past. This
: future is still the same.

[snip]

Yeah, I have not seen too many examples of this one. I think The One came closest, with its multi-verse. I have a vague sense of having seen an example of this recently, but I cannot remember what it is...

Groundhog's Day was somewhat like this too.

Your idea at the end was cool. You should write a story or something. :)

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Pre-2004 Posts

Replies:

Plotline question concerning InfinityIcarus 11/15/06 12:18 p.m.
     Re: Plotline question concerning InfinityForrest of B.org 11/15/06 1:10 p.m.
           Re: Plotline question concerning InfinityRyokoTK 11/15/06 1:43 p.m.
                 Re: Plotline question concerning InfinityForrest of B.org 11/15/06 3:51 p.m.
                       Re: Plotline question concerning InfinityForrest of B.org 11/15/06 3:59 p.m.
                       time travel and plots in generalMrHen 11/15/06 6:08 p.m.
                             Re: time travel and plots in generalpatrick 11/15/06 6:48 p.m.
                             Re: time travel and plots in generalForrest of B.org 11/15/06 7:57 p.m.
                                   more on plotMrHen 11/16/06 5:07 a.m.
                                         Re: more on plotDocument 11/18/06 11:39 a.m.
                                               I would not know.MrHen 11/18/06 12:33 p.m.
                                                     Re: I would not know.Document 11/18/06 12:44 p.m.
                                                           oh, okay. :)MrHen 11/18/06 3:37 p.m.
                                                                 Re: oh, okay. :)thermoplyae 11/18/06 7:18 p.m.
                                   Re: time travel and plots in generalLegacyTyphoon 11/17/06 12:39 a.m.
                                         Re: time travelFrungi 11/17/06 1:04 p.m.
                                               Re: time travelDocument 11/17/06 1:09 p.m.
                                                     Re: time travelMrHen 11/17/06 2:51 p.m.
                                                     Re: time travelFrungi 11/18/06 1:09 p.m.
                                                           Re: time travelDocument 11/20/06 11:01 a.m.
                                                                 well, obviouslyMrHen 11/20/06 12:17 p.m.
                                                                       Re: well, obviouslyFrungi 11/20/06 5:01 p.m.
                                                                             Re: well, obviouslyForrest of B.org 11/20/06 6:52 p.m.
                                                                                   unilinear?MrHen 11/21/06 4:49 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: unilinear?Frungi 11/21/06 5:49 a.m.
                                                                                               gah, no...MrHen 11/21/06 6:21 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: gah, no...Frungi 11/21/06 7:41 a.m.
                                                                                                           Re: gah, no...MrHen 11/21/06 8:25 a.m.
                                                                                                                 Hypothetical questionFrungi 11/21/06 1:45 p.m.
                                                                                                                       Hypothetical answersMrHen 11/22/06 4:53 a.m.
                                                                                                                             Re: Hypothetical answersFrungi 11/22/06 4:24 p.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: Hypothetical answersMrHen 11/23/06 7:52 a.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: Hypothetical answersFrungi 11/23/06 9:11 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: Hypothetical answersMrHen 11/23/06 4:04 p.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: gah, no...Forrest of B.org 11/21/06 8:19 p.m.
                                                                                                                       there are no time-loopsMrHen 11/22/06 4:21 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: unilinear?Forrest of B.org 11/21/06 8:07 p.m.
                                                                                               Something is wrong...MrHen 11/22/06 4:35 a.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Something is wrong...Forrest of B.org 11/22/06 9:09 a.m.
                                                                                                           this is awesome, I love this stuffMrHen 11/22/06 9:33 a.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: this is awesome, I love this stufftreellama 11/22/06 11:25 a.m.
                                                                                                                       Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffForrest of B.org 11/22/06 12:00 p.m.
                                                                                                                             Re: this is awesome, I love this stufftreellama 11/22/06 2:41 p.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffForrest of B.org 11/22/06 5:48 p.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: this is awesome, I love this stufftreellama 11/23/06 4:58 a.m.
                                                                                                                                               ha, niceMrHen 11/23/06 8:05 a.m.
                                                                                                                             Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffDocument 9/18/07 11:06 a.m.
                                                                                                                 Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffForrest of B.org 11/22/06 12:28 p.m.
                                                                                                                       Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffFrungi 11/22/06 4:07 p.m.
                                                                                                                             Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffForrest of B.org 11/22/06 6:05 p.m.
                                                                                                                                   Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffDocument 11/22/06 7:14 p.m.
                                                                                                                                         Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffFrungi 11/22/06 7:31 p.m.
                                                                                                                                               Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffForrest of B.org 11/23/06 12:37 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                     Re: this is awesome, I love this stuff *LINK*Frungi 11/25/06 1:15 p.m.
                                                                                                                                                           Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffForrest of B.org 11/26/06 10:04 a.m.
                                                                                                                                                                 Re: this is awesome, I love this stuffFrungi 11/26/06 6:30 p.m.
                                                                                                                                   timeline == ?MrHen 11/23/06 8:09 a.m.
                                                                                                                       agreement :)MrHen 11/23/06 8:00 a.m.
                                                                                                           Re: Something is wrong...Aachim 11/22/06 1:24 p.m.
                                                                                         returning to time travelPfhorever 11/23/06 10:13 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: returning to time travelFrungi 11/23/06 10:43 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: well, obviouslyDocument 11/21/06 10:30 a.m.
                                               Re: time travelForrest of B.org 11/17/06 3:47 p.m.
                                                     Re: time travellegacytyphoon 11/17/06 8:29 p.m.
                                                           Re: time travelDocument 11/17/06 9:17 p.m.
                                                                 Re: time travelFrungi 11/18/06 1:07 p.m.
                                                                       Re: time travelDocument 11/19/06 5:59 a.m.
                                                     I disagree *LINK*MrHen 11/18/06 6:55 a.m.
                                   Re: time travel and plots in generalFrungi 11/21/06 7:48 a.m.
                                         Re: time travel and plots in generalForrest of B.org 11/21/06 8:26 p.m.
                             Re: time travel and plots in generalVid Boi 11/16/06 6:18 a.m.
                                   Re: time travel and plots in generalD-M.A. 11/16/06 8:38 a.m.
     Re: Plotline question concerning Infinitythermoplyae 11/15/06 2:05 p.m.
           *cough* spam *cough*MrHen 11/15/06 3:35 p.m.
           Re: Plotline question concerning InfinitySnowCrash 11/15/06 4:12 p.m.
                 Re: Plotline question concerning Infinitythermoplyae 11/15/06 5:03 p.m.
                       Re: Plotline question concerning Infinitykyjel 11/15/06 5:06 p.m.
                             Re: Plotline question concerning Infinitythermoplyae 11/15/06 6:14 p.m.
                                   Re: Plotline question concerning InfinityDocument 11/16/06 10:10 a.m.
                                         Re: Plotline question concerning InfinityREB 11/16/06 7:31 p.m.
                                               REB!!! *NM*ukimalefu 11/16/06 8:24 p.m.
                                                     Re: Hey, ukimalefu! *NM*REB 11/17/06 9:41 a.m.
                                               MrHen apologized it for in his post, but thanks :) *NM*thermoplyae 11/16/06 11:27 p.m.
                                               WMaiDAaron Sikes 11/17/06 9:33 a.m.
                                                     Re: WMaiDkyjel 11/17/06 10:28 a.m.
                                               It was a joke. >. *NM*MrHen 11/17/06 2:49 p.m.
                                                     Re: Got It ;-) *NM*REB 11/17/06 3:07 p.m.
                 WMaiD *LINK*Blayne 11/17/06 11:24 a.m.
                       Re: WMaiDSnowCrash 11/18/06 10:31 a.m.
                             Re: WMaiDBlayne 11/21/06 10:18 a.m.
                                   Re: WMaiDAaron Sikes 11/21/06 10:50 a.m.
                                   Re: WMaiDFrungi 11/21/06 7:09 p.m.

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