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| Re: Your stats are nice. Boltshot is still OP. | |
| Posted By: munky-058 <munky.058@gmail.com> | Date: 1/11/13 8:16 p.m. |
In Response To: Your stats are nice. Boltshot is still OP. (NsU Soldier) : 1.) A bit under one in nine for total kills in a pool of eleven weapons still : means that the Boltshot is doing really well for that pool. Better than : what the statistical average would be. It would be a statistical average if you could spawn with any of those other weapons. Just because they're all close-quarters doesn't mean they can be directly compared to the Boltshot. That's why I repeatedly point out that they are power weapons. As in you can't spawn with them, so you can't compare them directly. : 2.) Did you not notice that it was only second to melee in terms of kills?
You also spawn with Melee. And melee is fairly common in every playlist. Kind of a big point. : The Plasma Pistol is a sidearm, it belonged in that comparison. It's as much a sidearm as the sticky det, in that their primary use isn't one-on-one combat scenarios, but rather tactical approaches to an engagement. As has been pointed out, using the plasma pistol as a kill-oriented weapon is folly. That's not its niche. It's primary purpose is shield-popping and vehicle disabling. Were the single shots more powerful than a gentle nudge, then yes, it would belong in the comparison. Let's look at it this way: You have no Plasma Pistol deaths. Does this mean you've never come up against one? Have you never had a death ATTRIBUTED to a Plasma Pistol? I see far, far more Plasma Pistols than Magnums in MatchMaking, and see them used more often in my demise than the Boltshot. : Because it's a sidearm. I was only including close-quarter ordinance power
You say "clearer understanding of the Boltshot's place", yet you list the Gravity Hammer in your list. Among the other rare weapons as well. And that's beside the fact that all of these are weapons you may go a dozen games without encountering. And yet, in your eyes, simply because the Boltshot has more kills than these, it's far more powerful than them at close-quarters? : 1.) The kills with those weapons are also less because you actually have to
Not only do you have to work for them, but you may not run into them at all. Gravity Hammer only exists in Infinity gametypes, Sword only spawns on Complex and Adrift (IIRC), Shotgun is very rare to get as a Drop, and the Ball only exists in Oddball. : 2.) A big part of that point was that Wu's argument was, "You're
You're smarter than the idiocy of this entire "point". : 1.) "Distributed fairly"? So ours were distributed
It meant that my games aren't distributed equally among the gametypes, but rather, FAIRLY EQUALLY. Which means "mostly-ish". : 2.) You don't have significantly different results. That's the funny part.
More time in game means more time at the mercy of every weapon. Considering that the Magnum has caught up to the Boltshot, with the Scattershot not that far behind (being a rare power weapon), that's a significant difference. : 1.) I guarantee you were killed by a magnum in SWAT. (And for each time you
I've only played maybe three games of SWAT, and the BR was almost exclusively what killed me. The problem is that you treat the Plasma Pistol as falling into the same role of the Boltshot and Magnum, when it's not even close. The fact that they are handguns in the sense that you could hold them with one hand does NOT make them similar weapons. They are to be used for vastly different purposes, with the Magnum, in this regard, being the LEAST "useful" in general combat. It can't stop vehicles, it can't track and pop shields, it can't one-hit-kill at close range... It is not an appealing weapon. I myself have NO loadout with the magnum other than my Spartan Ops loadout, and that's ONLY so that I won't have as much trouble with the weapon racks.
AND YET, the number of deaths I have by magnum are the same as the deaths I have by Boltshot. The Plasma Pistol can NOT be compared to either of these weapons in terms of direct kills. : 2.) Boltshot is STILL number two, only to melee. (Keep in mind that melee is
We've established that other than the magnum (and Plasma Pistol, which you keep lobbing into this), it's also the ONLY weapon in this group that you can spawn with. : I didn't *fail* to include it, it didn't belong. I only included the
Honestly, it would make better sense to include the sticky det than the plasma pistol, since it has far more in common with the other Close-Quarter Power Weapons than the Plasma Pistol has with the Boltshot. : 1.) Grenades aren't an inherently close-quarter weapon. That's like
That's why I didn't include them, and I never said they are. I'm merely pointing out that they have been used much more often to kill in close-quarters combat than medium or long range, and yet they aren't included in the list. : 2.) I'm going to roll with the percentage that didn't include the AR. One in
IT. IS. NOT. AN. EVEN. POOL. : And you say this like that's totally okay. It was jokingly nodding to you using the zero deaths-via-Plasma-Pistol as part of your hyperbolic "TWO OTHER SIDEARMS COMBINED" point. But yes, actually. It meant that the Magnum and Boltshot are even when it comes to kills. : " Only outnumber the two most common deaths I have at the hands of
I kind of screwed up here by not explicitly stating that I meant to say that it only took the combination of two uncommon weapons to match the very common Boltshot in kills. You used the point of using very rare weapons to make the same point, but in a manner more convenient for your argument. : The AR is a PRIMARY weapon that is inherently a MEDIUM range weapon, the
Fair enough, assuming the AR is used almost exclusively for medium-range encounters... Which it isn't. : You agree that the Boltshot will be the dominant sidearm you will be killed
If it was an ordnance drop/map spawn weapon and it had those stats, then by god yes, that would be an over-powered monster. As it stands, the Scattershot is the only weapon that approaches such numbers. As far as being the "dominant sidearm", see my previous points to remind yourself why that entire argument is asinine. : Why would you even be talking about nerfing the Boltshot if the entire point
Because I can see things from another person's perspective and find points that I can acknowledge and agree on. And sometimes I can concede support of my beliefs for the greater good. These do indeed seem to be alien concepts on this forum, but I highly recommend them for everyone here. : In your fact-supported experience (implying mine wasn't, haha) it is. Not implying anything other than my argument had points that I believe support it, much the same way you believe your argument does. I was just saying that according to my numbers, I wasn't just blowing out hot air. : I agree it needs to be re balanced because it is un balanced...nerfing
rebalancing =/= overpowered. It simply means that it could be tweaked to better fit a balanced role. I even suggest how that could be done, and part of that was increasing its damage output.
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