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Re: Worst line of the series, period.
Posted By: Avateur <avateur@gmail.com>Date: 2/19/11 2:24 p.m.

In Response To: Re: Worst line of the series, period. (Leisandir)


: "What isn't often identified is that the method is only functional for
: the genesis of the story."

: A lot of what was in this thread was very anti-Halo 3, and I know there's a
: lot of anti-Halo 2 sentiment, as well. I was merely trying to point out
: that - to borrow your wording - it's unfair to compare the first two to
: the original because, by necessity, it had a different type of
: storytelling. In CE, you learn by wandering around and listening to
: Cortana, or through some very efficient dialogue. In the second two games,
: there is far more cinema: yes, Cortana still speaks with you during the
: missions, but you get to see the Covenant through the neutral eyes of the
: third person cinematic.

Yes, but H3 can be compared to H2, which had so much cut and reworked right in the middle of production, and in that regard H3 is a huge let down. For the record, I love H3 and have quite fond memories of its campaign, including much of the story. The overall story, as has clearly been pointed out by others and myself, has many issues that I feel could have been handled better. I can fully love and appreciate that campaign while being critical of it. And H1 could have still been generic, poor, or even awful (like Killzone) and still have led to sequels. It wasn't any of those things, and thus deserves all of the praise it gets.

: I think that the bare bones of what I'm trying to say are as follows: the
: first game's exposition was necessarily different, and so neither better
: nor worse, than the sequels, and to say things along the lines of
: [paraphrased] "Halo's storytelling was so superior to Halo
: 2/3's" is inherently unfair.

It might be slightly unfair, but not really. Everything has to have a beginning, and it could have been handled terribly. Considering how the story and pacing branches out across all ten levels, it was done in superior fashion to H2 and H3. If anything, H3 has far less of an excuse to have the first fourth or third of the game be as it is.

: Arguable. "From the beginning, you know the end." If they had just
: stuck to the battle of Reach as we knew, the game would've been one level
: and would introduce nothing new.

The many re-writes I've seen here show that you can fully include the novel and make the game work, you can completely leave out the novel and make the game work, or you can pick and choose as you'd like and make the game work in terms of story. Bungie neglected to use the novel for some reason, and the overall story itself is riddled with problems in terms of pacing, structure, and execution. Again, I still love the campaign, but these points are undeniable. I still would even love to defend that story if I get the chance some time, but it's a defense from an odd perspective and is still probably relatively weak considering all of the story's problems. :(

Message Index



Replies:

'Were it so easy.'SonofMacPhisto 2/16/11 11:33 p.m.
     Halo 3's Storytelling...uberfoop 2/17/11 12:03 a.m.
           Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Hawaiian Pig 2/17/11 12:09 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...GrimBrother One 2/17/11 12:19 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Narcogen 2/17/11 12:30 a.m.
                       Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Hawaiian Pig 2/17/11 12:53 a.m.
                             Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...thebruce0 2/17/11 9:22 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Flynn J Taggart 2/17/11 1:49 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 1:59 a.m.
                       Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Hawaiian Pig 2/17/11 2:20 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Kaidon 047 2/17/11 6:57 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...ManKitten 2/17/11 9:29 a.m.
           Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 1:54 a.m.
           Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...The BS Police 2/17/11 2:43 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Avateur 2/17/11 6:33 a.m.
           Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Jillybean 2/17/11 10:49 a.m.
                 Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Narcogen 2/17/11 10:34 p.m.
                       Re: Halo 3's Storytelling...Jillybean 2/18/11 10:57 a.m.
           Upon further consideration.uberfoop 2/17/11 3:25 p.m.
                 Re: Upon further consideration.Hawaiian Pig 2/17/11 4:10 p.m.
                 Re: Upon further consideration.Metalingus627 2/17/11 5:29 p.m.
                       Re: Upon further consideration.Narcogen 2/17/11 10:32 p.m.
                             Re: Upon further consideration.Flynn J Taggart 2/18/11 12:28 a.m.
     It's a beautiful cutscene.padraig08 2/17/11 12:05 a.m.
           Re: It's a beautiful cutscene.uberfoop 2/17/11 12:21 a.m.
           Re: It's a beautiful cutscene.Stephen L. (SoundEffect) 2/17/11 6:42 a.m.
     The cutscene that does it for me is...GrimBrother One 2/17/11 12:25 a.m.
           Re: The cutscene that does it for me is...Jaydee 2/17/11 12:38 a.m.
           Re: The cutscene that does it for me is...SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 1:49 a.m.
           Re: The cutscene that does it for me is...Leviathan 2/17/11 2:42 a.m.
                 Re: The cutscene that does it for me is...Stephen L. (SoundEffect) 2/17/11 6:45 a.m.
           completely agree, one of my favorites for sure *NM*T07WRX5 2/17/11 2:19 p.m.
           Re: The cutscene that does it for me is...Narcogen 2/17/11 10:28 p.m.
           This^ *NM*Kermit 2/17/11 11:15 p.m.
     Re: 'Were it so easy.'Jaydee 2/17/11 12:28 a.m.
           Re: 'Were it so easy.'SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 2:06 a.m.
                 Re: 'Were it so easy.'Leviathan 2/17/11 2:08 a.m.
                       Re: 'Were it so easy.'SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 2:11 a.m.
                             Re: 'Were it so easy.'Leviathan 2/17/11 2:18 a.m.
                                   Re: 'Were it so easy.'SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 2:20 a.m.
                                         Re: 'Were it so easy.'Leviathan 2/17/11 2:36 a.m.
     Worst line of the series, period.Kermit 2/17/11 5:49 a.m.
           Re: Worst line of the series, period.Azo 'Galvat 2/17/11 7:47 a.m.
                 Re: Worst line of the series, period.General Battuta 2/17/11 8:28 a.m.
                       Same. *NM*Beckx 2/17/11 9:35 a.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.kanbo 2/17/11 10:03 a.m.
                 Re: Worst line of the series, period.Kermit 2/17/11 10:10 a.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.Beckx 2/17/11 10:14 a.m.
                             Their, there, they're, thar. *NM*Beckx 2/17/11 10:15 a.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.Kermit 2/17/11 10:20 a.m.
                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.Beckx 2/17/11 10:23 a.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.Schooly D 2/17/11 10:26 a.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.General Battuta 2/17/11 10:29 a.m.
                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.ManKitten 2/17/11 10:32 a.m.
                                         Nicely phoneticized *NM*thebruce0 2/17/11 10:44 a.m.
                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 1:30 p.m.
                                         Re: Worst line of the series, period.Avateur 2/17/11 2:10 p.m.
                                               Re: Worst line of the series, period.Beckx 2/17/11 4:12 p.m.
                                                     Re: Worst line of the series, period.Avateur 2/17/11 6:22 p.m.
                                                           Re: Worst line of the series, period.Leisandir 2/18/11 10:39 p.m.
                                                                 Re: Worst line of the series, period.Avateur 2/18/11 11:09 p.m.
                                                                 Re: Worst line of the series, period.General Battuta 2/18/11 11:58 p.m.
                                                                 Re: Worst line of the series, period.uberfoop 2/19/11 12:12 a.m.
                                                                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.Leisandir 2/19/11 1:06 a.m.
                                                                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.Hawaiian Pig 2/19/11 1:11 a.m.
                                                                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.Leisandir 2/19/11 11:06 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Worst line of the series, period.Avateur 2/19/11 2:24 p.m.
                                                                                               Re: Worst line of the series, period.Leisandir 2/19/11 2:42 p.m.
                                                                                                     Re: Worst line of the series, period.uberfoop 2/19/11 3:16 p.m.
                                                                                                           Re: Worst line of the series, period.General Battuta 2/19/11 4:32 p.m.
                                                                                                           Re: Worst line of the series, period.SonofMacPhisto 2/19/11 4:49 p.m.
                                                                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.uberfoop 2/19/11 2:53 a.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.Beckx 2/17/11 10:33 a.m.
                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.NsU Soldier 2/17/11 11:47 a.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.Azo 'Galvat 2/17/11 10:43 a.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.Narcogen 2/17/11 10:27 p.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.Stephen L. (SoundEffect) 2/17/11 10:32 a.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.thebruce0 2/17/11 10:53 a.m.
                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.Stephen L. (SoundEffect) 2/17/11 11:10 a.m.
                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.JDQuackers 2/17/11 1:11 p.m.
                                         Re: Worst line of the series, period.thebruce0 2/17/11 1:55 p.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.Hawaiian Pig 2/17/11 3:49 p.m.
                                   Re: Worst line of the series, period.Stephen L. (SoundEffect) 2/17/11 7:16 p.m.
                                         Re: Worst line of the series, period.DEEP NNN 2/17/11 7:51 p.m.
                                         Re: Worst line of the series, period.thebruce0 2/17/11 10:33 p.m.
                             Re: Worst line of the series, period.Narcogen 2/17/11 10:33 p.m.
                       Here is my brilliant analysisGeneral Battuta 2/17/11 10:35 a.m.
                             My Thoughts Exactly *NM*Bones153 2/17/11 10:43 a.m.
                             Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalKermit 2/17/11 10:53 a.m.
                                   Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalGeneral Battuta 2/17/11 10:59 a.m.
                                         ugh pardon typoes *NM*General Battuta 2/17/11 10:59 a.m.
                                         Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalKermit 2/17/11 11:50 a.m.
                                               Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalGeneral Battuta 2/17/11 11:55 a.m.
                                                     Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalKermit 2/17/11 11:59 a.m.
                                                     I think someone's too smart for their own good.The Loot 2/17/11 2:44 p.m.
                                                           Re: I think someone's too smart for their own goodKermit 2/17/11 4:31 p.m.
                                   Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttal343winks. 2/17/11 7:36 p.m.
                                         Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalKermit 2/17/11 11:02 p.m.
                                               Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalGeneral Battuta 2/18/11 12:22 a.m.
                                                     Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalKermit 2/18/11 1:22 a.m.
                                                           Re: Here is my brilliant rebuttalGeneral Battuta 2/18/11 8:29 a.m.
                                                     ^This *NM*SonofMacPhisto 2/18/11 3:17 p.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.Anton P. Nym (aka Steve) 2/17/11 10:46 a.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.Azo 'Galvat 2/17/11 11:07 a.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.ZackDark 2/17/11 5:16 p.m.
                       Re: Worst line of the series, period.343winks. 2/17/11 7:11 p.m.
           "To War" would like to have a word with you. *NM*Bones153 2/17/11 8:01 a.m.
                 Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Moorpheusl9 2/17/11 8:17 a.m.
                       Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Archilen 2/17/11 8:48 a.m.
                             Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Bry 2/17/11 9:35 a.m.
                                   Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 10:19 a.m.
                                         Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Leviathan 2/17/11 10:46 a.m.
                                               Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Azo 'Galvat 2/17/11 11:09 a.m.
                                               Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Quirel 2/17/11 11:22 a.m.
                                                     Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.thebruce0 2/17/11 11:29 a.m.
                                               Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Metalingus627 2/17/11 1:51 p.m.
                                         Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Bry 2/17/11 10:48 a.m.
                                         Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.NsU Soldier 2/17/11 12:03 p.m.
                                               Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Archilen 2/17/11 12:05 p.m.
                                                     Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Bry 2/17/11 12:20 p.m.
                                                           Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.NsU Soldier 2/17/11 12:41 p.m.
                                               Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Azo 'Galvat 2/17/11 1:01 p.m.
                                                     Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.Moorpheusl9 2/17/11 1:26 p.m.
                                                           Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 1:43 p.m.
                                                                 Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.scarab 2/17/11 1:47 p.m.
                                                                       Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.General Battuta 2/17/11 2:28 p.m.
                                                                             Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 2:36 p.m.
                                                                                   Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.General Battuta 2/17/11 3:14 p.m.
                                                                                         Re: "To War" would like to have a word with you.SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 3:18 p.m.
                                                                                         In a way, yes7he grunt w/a plasma pistol 2/17/11 3:37 p.m.
                                         Miranda wasn't thinking at all!The BS Police 2/17/11 1:43 p.m.
                                               Women drivers....bluerunner 2/17/11 1:54 p.m.
                                               Re: Miranda wasn't thinking at all!Bry 2/17/11 2:22 p.m.
                                               I'll tell you what doesn't make senseGeneral Battuta 2/17/11 2:30 p.m.
                                                     And man, poor Johnson!General Battuta 2/17/11 2:34 p.m.
                                                           I came back to life for this?! *NM*Moorpheusl9 2/17/11 2:37 p.m.
                                                           He's not dead but don't ask... *NM*scarab 2/17/11 2:42 p.m.
                                                                 I can't divulge classified information...Quirel 2/17/11 5:35 p.m.
                                                                       Re: I can't divulge classified information...scarab 2/17/11 7:01 p.m.
                                                                             Awesome AnalysisSparkypinball 2/18/11 3:35 a.m.
                                                                                   Oh thank you :-)scarab 2/18/11 4:47 a.m.
                                                                                         Re: Oh thank you :-)topleybird 2/18/11 8:58 a.m.
                                                                                               Re: Oh thank you :-)scarab 2/18/11 11:16 a.m.
                                               Re: Miranda wasn't thinking at all!343winks. 2/17/11 7:45 p.m.
                                                     Re: Miranda wasn't thinking at all!The BS Police 2/17/11 7:47 p.m.
                                                     Re: Miranda wasn't thinking at all!NsU Soldier 2/17/11 9:31 p.m.
                                                           Re: Miranda wasn't thinking at all!SonofMacPhisto 2/17/11 11:08 p.m.
           Re: BEST line of the series, probably.Narcogen 2/17/11 10:23 p.m.
                 Boy, this is fun!Kermit 2/17/11 11:13 p.m.
                       er, backwards^ *NM*Kermit 2/17/11 11:18 p.m.
                             Fun, this is boy? *NM*Narcogen 2/18/11 12:47 a.m.
                                   Ok but...MartytheElder 2/18/11 12:52 a.m.
                                         Re: Ok but...The Loot 2/18/11 12:56 a.m.
                                         Re: Ok but...Kermit 2/18/11 1:16 a.m.
                                               Re: Ok but...Joe Duplessie (SNIPE 316) 2/18/11 8:46 a.m.
                                               Re: Ok but...SonofMacPhisto 2/18/11 3:21 p.m.
                                                     Re: Ok but...Kermit 2/18/11 4:31 p.m.
                                         Re: Ok but...Narcogen 2/18/11 1:52 a.m.
                                         E Dorian?!Hyokin 2/18/11 9:26 a.m.
                                               Re: E Dorian?!Kermit 2/18/11 4:38 p.m.
                                         Re: Ok but...SonofMacPhisto 2/18/11 3:13 p.m.
                                         Re: Ok but...Hawaiian Pig 2/18/11 4:25 p.m.



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